Opinions on Nooalf

Methods and means of supporting critical thinking in education
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:05 am

marom1963 wrote:People speaking dialects often have trouble understanding one another - writing in dialectal phonetics would lead to a state of complete confusion. That was why the standardized spelling was developed in the first place. Dialectal phonetic spelling was driving people crazy. Everyone spelled as he pleased - half the time, nobody knew what anyone was writing.


No it woudnt and no it wuznt.

You shoud read about the history uv English. Its a fasinating story uv war, teknolojy, relijun, bad luck, politics, more war and random events. Hardly anything about problem solving. The Story uv English

Herez a fun video about it if you arent into books:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfKhlJIAhew
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Poodle » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:24 am

How do you spell 'cleave' in Nooalf, JO?

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:36 pm

KLEV
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby scrmbldggs » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:29 pm

ImageImageImage?

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:43 pm

:lol:

SE? ITS EZE!
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Monster » Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:06 am

How difficult would it be for deaf people to learn Nooalf? Specifically deaf people who were deaf since birth. They have no notion of what something sounds like, thus Nooalf would seem useless to them.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:50 am

Poodle wrote:How do you spell 'cleave' in Nooalf, JO?
JO 753 wrote:KLEV

So "rev" as in revving a car would be "REV". Yet "Cleave" sounds nothing like "rev". :roll:

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:40 am

JO 753 wrote:Check this out and tell me wut you think: www.nooalf.com

Too hard to read for many reasons.
Colors ~ font ~ mixed up letters lol
That's some strange crew u got there :lol:
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby marom1963 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:39 am

Nooalf is a crackpot concept - plain and simple. It's worse than Ebonics! The standardized spelling of the English language is the way to go - especially, as pointed out above, there are deaf people to consider. There has never been strict conformity between any written language and its spoken version. Take Latin, for instance; there was a wide variance between the written language and the language spoken on the streets, so much of a difference that the written language, Classical Latin, is deemed a literary language, while the spoken language, Vulgar Latin, is known only through graffiti and the letters of the uneducated. Nooalf reads like those letters: the writing of the pathetically ignorant.

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:12 am

Monster wrote:How difficult would it be for deaf people to learn Nooalf?


It woud be at least 1,000x eazier than regular English sins they dont haf to learn every word independently. And they woud gain far greater insite kuz they woud be able to see wich wordz sound similar. Poetry woud make more sens kuz theyd see the rimez.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:14 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Poodle wrote:How do you spell 'cleave' in Nooalf, JO?
JO 753 wrote:KLEV

So "rev" as in revving a car would be "REV". Yet "Cleave" sounds nothing like "rev". :roll:


ReV. VRQQQM VRRRQQQQQMMM!
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:16 am

Angel wrote:
JO 753 wrote:Check this out and tell me wut you think: www.nooalf.com

Too hard to read for many reasons.
Colors ~ font ~ mixed up letters lol
That's some strange crew u got there :lol:

Klik the plaint text button at the upper left hand. I suppoze youre on a lower cost smartfone, rite?
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:18 am

marom1963 wrote:Nooalf is a crackpot concept - plain and simple.


Not much on lerning the subject befor commenting are you? At least you hav the excuse uv being new here.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby marom1963 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:17 am

JO 753 wrote:
Monster wrote:How difficult would it be for deaf people to learn Nooalf?


It woud be at least 1,000x eazier than regular English sins they dont haf to learn every word independently. And they woud gain far greater insite kuz they woud be able to see wich wordz sound similar. Poetry woud make more sens kuz theyd see the rimez.

What study does that 1000x come from?
Look, I don't care how hard it is to learn how to spell. Let the little bastards struggle. It'll do them good. Me, I'd bring back good penmanship as a requirement, never mind being able to spell: good penmanship, correct spelling, proper grammar - and a proper and clear understanding of syntax. And they'd sit in elementary school until they were old and gray until they passed the standardized tests - no social promotions - a 70 year-old third grader, if necessary. Your status as an adult would not depend on your age but on your having a high school diploma - and you'd bust your ass getting one! Spelling, grammar, punctuation, nice penmanship ... advanced algebra, logic, and you'd be certified fluent in 2 foreign languages ... So, I'm not for letting people off the hook easily.

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 11:01 am

It kumz frum the study wich showz that the typical collej grad haz a vocabulary uv about 35,000 wordz and the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. Thats more than 1,000x the number uv letterz in the Nooalf system. And sins wordz are about 5 letterz on averaj, each wun takes much longer to memorize than each uv the nooalf letterz, so 1,000x iz a gross underestimate.

And very few collej gradz are actually able to correctly spell all the wordz they no, so they woud need to go back to grammar skool wen your plan iz impledemented. At an averaj cost uv 10,000$ per student per semester, that will be very expensiv. I segjest you employ the Minisota Spankalojikl Protocol nationwide to akselerate their education to hopefully keep the cost lower than the GDP.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Monster » Tue Jul 19, 2016 1:03 pm

JO 753 wrote:... the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. ...

That right there is false.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:40 pm

JO 753 wrote:
Angel wrote:
JO 753 wrote:Check this out and tell me wut you think: www.nooalf.com

Too hard to read for many reasons.
Colors ~ font ~ mixed up letters lol
That's some strange crew u got there :lol:

Klik the plaint text button at the upper left hand. I suppoze youre on a lower cost smartfone, rite?


Crappy iPhone lol :-P
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:14 pm

I thot all iPhonez were perfect and great and expensiv. Until the next edition came out any way.

Monster wrote:
JO 753 wrote:... the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. ...

That right there is false.


nu u! Even wen a word duz match wut youd expect, you cant be sure until you check.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby OlegTheBatty » Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:58 pm

JO 753 wrote:I thot all iPhonez were perfect and great and expensiv. Until the next edition came out any way.

Monster wrote:
JO 753 wrote:... the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. ...

That right there is false.


nu u! Even wen a word duz match wut youd expect, you cant be sure until you check.

Yes I can.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Monster » Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:56 pm

JO 753 wrote:I thot all iPhonez were perfect and great and expensiv. Until the next edition came out any way.

Monster wrote:
JO 753 wrote:... the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. ...

That right there is false.


nu u! Even wen a word duz match wut youd expect, you cant be sure until you check.

Still wrong.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:02 pm

nu UuU! (Oleg & Monster) Herez how to test your claim:

Find a kindergarten teacher willing to let you test her class. Hav them rite the wordz you say. Sea whow meney off theym ged 100% coreqt. THEN! Move up to 1st grade, 2nd, 3rd etc.

Even if you stick to basic, hi rate common wordz, you mite NEVER get to a grade in wich all the students get 100%.

Its a pure referens system; you dont THINK about spelling with sum sorta lojik, you recall a standard.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:12 am

Stoopid Incorporated

A poorly ritten article, but its true - companyz create and nurture stupidity. Mediocrity rizez, exellens sinks.

I expect you no wy I'm posting this here. Its my belief that stupid 'group habits' (traditionz?) are able to flourish in this sivilization bekuz peepl are trained from their earlyest formativ yirz that stupid iz OK az long az everybodyz partisipating in it.

There iz virtually no limit on how stooopid sumthing can be if enuff peepl are doing it. We can look at groups we arent part uv and laff at their idiotic traditionz, but anybody in that group hoo realizez how stoopid sumthing iz either goez along anyway or gets supressed or eliminated.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:57 pm

JO 753 wrote:
Monster wrote:How difficult would it be for deaf people to learn Nooalf?


It woud be at least 1,000x eazier than regular English sins they dont haf to learn every word independently. And they woud gain far greater insite kuz they woud be able to see wich wordz sound similar. Poetry woud make more sens kuz theyd see the rimez.


Don't deaf people have to imagine the sound ?
So it would depend on their imagination's
ability to create sound? Hearing people are
told what to hear.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:18 pm

I dont think so. They can just read and see 'therez an E on this line in the last word just like the last line' and understanding the konsept uv riming, can get sum idea uv how a poem works.

You cant really imajin sumthing you never had sensory experiens with. Did you see Ex Machina? Caleb (Domhnall Gleeson) tellz a little story about Mary, who livez in a black & wite room and iz tot everything there iz to no about color, but never seez it until the day they let her outside.

An anjel can tell us humanz everything about jAXoV and tell us endless storyz involving it, but without the sensory equipment, we cant empathize or completely understand.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Fri Nov 04, 2016 9:17 am

Good to see Nooalf iz finally catching on. From the Skeptics Society Forum search rezults:

The following words in your search query were ignored because they are too common words: HQ aM i TQ JUJ.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:50 am

JO 753 wrote:I dont think so. They can just read and see 'therez an E on this line in the last word just like the last line' and understanding the konsept uv riming, can get sum idea uv how a poem works.

You cant really imajin sumthing you never had sensory experiens with. Did you see Ex Machina? Caleb (Domhnall Gleeson) tellz a little story about Mary, who livez in a black & wite room and iz tot everything there iz to no about color, but never seez it until the day they let her outside.

An anjel can tell us humanz everything about jAXoV and tell us endless storyz involving it, but without the sensory equipment, we cant empathize or completely understand.


Understanding hearing is complicated.
Does anybody actually experience silence?
Where does the knowledge of sound come
from when you are deaf?
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:29 pm

Peepl sumtimez experiens temporary defness due to dezeez or drugz or injury. I think thats the only time, kuz otherwize therez alwayz your breathing, heartbeat, tinitus.

And in your case, the constant voisez telling you to strip naked, grab a nife & go on a berserker run. (me to! Its the Viking blud in our ansestry)
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Mon Nov 28, 2016 12:09 pm

JO 753 wrote:Peepl sumtimez experiens temporary defness due to dezeez or drugz or injury. I think thats the only time, kuz otherwize therez alwayz your breathing, heartbeat, tinitus.

And in your case, the constant voisez telling you to strip naked, grab a nife & go on a berserker run. (me to! Its the Viking blud in our ansestry)


Ya I was thinking about it ~ silence is the
only victim as it isn't heard by the living.
You have to be dead to hear it. That's
probably why death is soooo suductivr ~
for the silence. I don't actually hear voices.
I have to strain my ears too much to pick up
on what they are saying. lol

Vikings is not my zen. I'm more apt to
lay back and let the Holy Spirit do the
work. ;-)
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:12 pm

That coud make you very lazy. Youd be wun uv thoze blobz uv fat in a flying Barko Lounjer frum Wall-E.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:43 pm

JO 753 wrote:That coud make you very lazy. Youd be wun uv thoze blobz uv fat in a flying Barko Lounjer frum Wall-E.


Helz no ~ it frees up your time.
I'm not into retaining fat.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:56 pm

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Fri Jan 13, 2017 4:43 pm

Society is helpless because they are
rule followers and they do not have a
good set of social rules to follow anymore .
The lab rats have been set free by the hippies
yet they don't know what to do. So they do
what ever.
To be or not to be?
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To be live or
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To exist or
Not to exist?
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:35 pm

Angel wrote:The lab rats have been set free by the hippies


Thats an odd statement.

Are hippyz making a come back?

Who are the lab rats?
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:21 pm

JO 753 wrote:
Angel wrote:The lab rats have been set free by the hippies


Thats an odd statement.

Are hippyz making a come back?

Who are the lab rats?


I look at your pic' and think that I'm
beating a dead monkey (in this human
race) oh yea!! Lol

Hippies are calling themselves
BabyBoomers and Zoomers now.
They left their first love to become
just like their parents ~ the man ~ the suits.
Big brother etc... They take over where
their parents leave off.
Unfortunately they are not dominating
nature very well. No ~ they became important
people ~ pillers of society. Not responsible
for anything because it's their parents fault.
The lab rats are the children born in poverty
that don't survive the diseases created by
big Corp crap. It's the catch 22 of the rich
people. You created them so now you have to
deal with them. LoL

Ps~ I am but the least of the least.
You should see the crazy out there. O.O
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:21 pm

Teeline

Odd that I never herd uv this before. Its a type uv shorthand.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Angel » Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:58 pm

I survaied the young people.
More than enough agree that
children should be taught
proper English ~ slang on the side.
I also agree.
:-)
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:05 am

From the Bible, Proverbz 22:6:

“Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he iz old, he will not depart frum it.”

I'v alwayz thot Vladimir Lenin wuz the orijinal author uv that idea. Not that I'd bothered to investigate it.

"Give me 4 yirs to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted."

I bet that it goez back way befor the Bible. Probably even predates ritten languaj. My version uv it iz 2 wordz: sement hed.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Nikki Nyx » Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:51 pm

JO 753 wrote:So it duznt bug you that kidz spend 10x more time memorizng spelling than learning math?

For the most part, they wouldn't have to if schools still taught Latin and Greek word roots. Schools did not when my daughter was attending; I taught them to her during a year of home-schooling (necessitated by a chronic medical issue). Her elementary school's idea of teaching spelling was a ridiculously time-consuming "spelling packet" due at the end of each week. Each packet included 25 words which the student had to use at least five different ways, such as in a sentence, accompanied by an illustration, made into an acrostic, etc. Time-wasting nonsense.
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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby Nikki Nyx » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:58 pm

JO 753 wrote:It kumz frum the study wich showz that the typical collej grad haz a vocabulary uv about 35,000 wordz and the spelling uv each had to be memorized individually. Thats more than 1,000x the number uv letterz in the Nooalf system. And sins wordz are about 5 letterz on averaj, each wun takes much longer to memorize than each uv the nooalf letterz, so 1,000x iz a gross underestimate.

And very few collej gradz are actually able to correctly spell all the wordz they no, so they woud need to go back to grammar skool wen your plan iz impledemented. At an averaj cost uv 10,000$ per student per semester, that will be very expensiv. I segjest you employ the Minisota Spankalojikl Protocol nationwide to akselerate their education to hopefully keep the cost lower than the GDP.

This is more an excoriation of the current state of public education than it is of standard English spelling. In my city, I personally know two families that had to fight the School Board to have their children kept back. Both children were scheduled to be automatically promoted to the next grade—peer promotion—and both families quite rightly felt it was stupid to expose their children to more advanced material when they hadn't grasped the foundational material.

The problem with the typical college graduate having a vocabulary of 35,000 words is that he should have never been allowed to graduate high school...and probably not been promoted to high school from grammar school. A college student should not require a course entitled "Freshman English Composition." You should not be still learning your native language in college. If you cannot write coherently—using proper grammar, spelling, and punctuation—you don't belong in college.

I do see a few issues with Nooalf, to be honest, quite aside from my knee-jerk distaste, which I'm ignoring. (I must also admit that I didn't read the entire 12-page thread, so you may have already addressed some or all of these.)

• Nooalf eliminates the recognizable word roots from which it's possible to deduce the meanings of unfamiliar words. Let's say, for example, that I don't know the word "recognizable." Fortunately, I know my words roots, so I can puzzle out the meaning:
re = again
cogn = know
iz = cause, become
able = able to be
Therefore, recognizable = able to become known again. :mrgreen:
I believe Nooalf would render it as "ReKUGNiZUBUL." Is that correct in ASCII form? All those word roots are now gone, except "re" and "iz." Now I can no longer deduce the meaning.

• If Nooalf's spelling is based on pronunciation, how will this result in global standardization? Won't it end up with me (from New England) spelling aluminum like this: ULQMINUM, and a Brit spelling it like this: aLYQMINEUM, thus creating more confusion in written communication between dialects? I'm imagining chaos in the Massachusetts State House as politicians from the East end of the State insist the phrase is "PoK XU Ko," while the West end ones maintain it's "PaRK XU KaR." How will ESL speakers deal with this, given they will be speaking accented English?

• We can't even get the US to switch from standard to metric measures, a change that is nearly 100% positive; how do you plan to implement Nooalf in a population with a knee-jerk dislike for change?

Again, I apologize if you've already addressed these issues. If so, a link to your previous post would be awesome and appreciated. ;)
...it used to be so simple, once upon a time.
Because the universe was full of ignorance all around and the scientist panned through it like a prospector crouched over a mountain stream, looking for the gold of knowledge among the gravel of unreason, the sand of uncertainty, and the little whiskery eight-legged swimming things of superstition.
—Terry Pratchett, from Witches Abroad

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Re: Opinions on Nooalf

Postby JO 753 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:47 am

You are correct. All your consernz hav been adressed. But, insted uv having to plow thru all the repetition and churn, you can read Krazy JO'z Bad Lojik Skeet Shooting Klub on the site.

KoNGRaTS oN LRNING XU SISTUM WeL INUF TQ SPeL IT. MOST oBJeKTORZ NeVR BoXR TQ. XE ONLE eRORZ i NOTIST WR "PaRK" & "KaR".
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