Gun Safety

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Gawdzilla Sama
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 4:48 pm

Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I said nothing about governments.

Well, that's why I thought it strange that you made reference to "countries".

So what you meant is that foreign criminals illegally acquire guns from the U.S. and illegally smuggle them into illegal foreign markets, correct?

People come here from other countries to buy guns, because there are so many on the market. Some of them are used in illegal activities in those countries, and some of the sales are illegal in this country.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Paul Anthony » Thu Jun 30, 2016 5:52 pm

People don't have to come to America to get American guns. Just go to the Middle East. Our "allies" leave thousands of American-made weapons on the ground when they get scared and run away. You can even pick up slightly-used tanks there.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 6:12 pm

Paul Anthony wrote:People don't have to come to America to get American guns. Just go to the Middle East. Our "allies" leave thousands of American-made weapons on the ground when they get scared and run away. You can even pick up slightly-used tanks there.

Really? :roll:
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:06 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:People come here from other countries to buy guns, because there are so many on the market. Some of them are used in illegal activities in those countries, and some of the sales are illegal in this country.

According to the ATF it's legal for foreigners to come here and purchase firearms for export. But unless they have established residency, it isn't legal for them to own or posses firearms while they are here. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-nonimmigrant-alien-who-has-been-admitted-united-states-under-nonimmigrant-visa-and

Do you have a source for information on the volume of illegal smuggling of illegally purchased firearms out of the US? Just curious what details we know about this.

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:15 pm

I don't bookmark everything I read. I don't feel compelled to prove everything I say.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:45 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I don't bookmark everything I read. I don't feel compelled to prove everything I say.

Certainly. No worries.

But you'd agree that it's reasonable to ask "How do you know that", right?

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:49 pm

I know it because I speak with FBI men every few months and topic range while we have lunch.

You spoke of a special case, where the person has the gun on their person. Most accidental shootings by children happen when the gun owner doesn't have the weapon on them. (I know of one case where a kid reached up behind his father and pulled the trigger on he six-shooter. Sure looked like a toy. (And yes, he didn't have the safety on. Nobody's perfect.)
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:11 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I know it because I speak with FBI men every few months and topic range while we have lunch.

Is that an argument from authority? I would say you know what your FBI buddies said. But we don't know how they know what they claim they know.

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:You spoke of a special case, where the person has the gun on their person. Most accidental shootings by children happen when the gun owner doesn't have the weapon on them.

If a gun owner leaves an unsecured gun where a child can access it that's an act of negligence, not an accident. And it is illegal in most areas.

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:(I know of one case where a kid reached up behind his father and pulled the trigger on he six-shooter. Sure looked like a toy. (And yes, he didn't have the safety on. Nobody's perfect.)

No SECURE holster exposes the trigger when the gun is secured. Using unsafe equipment is again, negligence. I remember an instance where a police officer making a presentation at a grade school had a child poke his finger into the holster and fire the officer's weapon. The officer was cited for using improper equipment.

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:51 pm

Ah, only good guys, eh?
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:56 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Ah, only good guys, eh?

Is this a question to me? If so, I don't understand.

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jun 30, 2016 10:22 pm

Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Ah, only good guys, eh?

Is this a question to me? If so, I don't understand.

Gunners are always citing "perfect" situations, while ignoring how imperfect people are.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Paul Anthony » Fri Jul 01, 2016 12:26 am

An old friend who used to teach driver training said there should be a sign on all dashboards:
"CAUTION: Be sure brain is engaged before putting car in gear".
Maybe we should mandate a similar warning on all guns.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby psychiatry is a scam » Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:26 am

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
ElectricMonk wrote:Let's approach the subject of gun rights and controls from a different, hopefully less controversial angle:

my question is: what, if any, are the constitutional or moral objections to making guns less accident prone?

The issue with "ardent gunners" is the slippery slope. ANY regulation of firearms is seen as the first step in confiscation. Obviously that's not rational, but that's what you have to deal with when it comes to this matter.


has anyone mentioned the story about how Smith & Wesson almost went out of business 16? years ago ?
they thought gun safety would be good pr - but the nra told people to boycott them . stock dropped 95% ?
for the real minority ; there will be no justice , there will be no peace .
makes sense 2me , so it has 2be wrong .

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby ElectricMonk » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:42 am

If negligence is the problem, then the solution is simple: no gun until you passed a course and test showing you can carry and store it responsibly. A follow-up test every five years. Mandatory weapons checks in gun shops to make sure the weapon is in good shape.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby TJrandom » Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:33 am

Blacksamwell wrote:... and implement it without adding to the cost, and my objections are gone.


Oh surely you would be willing to pay a bit more if all of the other conditions were met?

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:34 am

ElectricMonk wrote:If negligence is the problem, then the solution is simple: no gun until you passed a course and test showing you can carry and store it responsibly. A follow-up test every five years. Mandatory weapons checks in gun shops to make sure the weapon is in good shape.

Why do you hate America?
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby ElectricMonk » Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:35 am

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Why do you hate America?


nothing personal.
I've come up with a set of rules that describe our reactions to technologies:
Spoiler:
1. Anything that is in the world when you’re born is normal and ordinary and is just a natural part of the way the world works.
2. Anything that's invented between when you’re fifteen and thirty-five is new and exciting and revolutionary and you can probably get a career in it.
3. Anything invented after you're thirty-five is against the natural order of things.
- Douglas Adams

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:42 am

Its on the news right now that one of the guns used in Istanbul was initially provided by the USA providing those weapons in that failed gun sting in Mexico. Sounds like.... criminals providing guns to whoever has the cash....on an Int'l basis.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Jul 01, 2016 10:40 am

ElectricMonk wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Why do you hate America?


nothing personal.

Allah snackbar!!!!
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:37 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Ah, only good guys, eh?

Is this a question to me? If so, I don't understand.

Gunners are always citing "perfect" situations, while ignoring how imperfect people are.

Am I the gunner in this scenario? Did I cite a perfect situation?

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:39 pm

TJrandom wrote:
Blacksamwell wrote:... and implement it without adding to the cost, and my objections are gone.


Oh surely you would be willing to pay a bit more if all of the other conditions were met?

Yes, I agree. You're likely correct.

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:40 pm

Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Ah, only good guys, eh?

Is this a question to me? If so, I don't understand.

Gunners are always citing "perfect" situations, while ignoring how imperfect people are.

Am I the gunner in this scenario? Did I cite a perfect situation?

You cited one that was perfect for you.
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:41 pm

Good guy with a bat stops man from killing his daughter. Don Gilbert is a true hero. :ok:

My heart is breaking for the little girl in this story. Don't know how anyone could do that to another. What a POS the father is.

Cops: Man with baseball bat stops father from killing 2-year-old girl | Miami Herald
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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Blacksamwell » Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:10 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Blacksamwell wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Ah, only good guys, eh?

Is this a question to me? If so, I don't understand.

Gunners are always citing "perfect" situations, while ignoring how imperfect people are.

Am I the gunner in this scenario? Did I cite a perfect situation?

You cited one that was perfect for you.

Sorry, I'm not following you.

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby TJrandom » Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:51 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Good guy with a bat stops man from killing his daughter. Don Gilbert is a true hero. :ok:

My heart is breaking for the little girl in this story. Don't know how anyone could do that to another. What a POS the father is.

Cops: Man with baseball bat stops father from killing 2-year-old girl | Miami Herald


A fundi on meth?

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby Aztexan » Sat Jul 02, 2016 1:35 am

Don't give meth a bad name.
This is a sentence. tHi5 iz a seN+3nce oN drUgs!!!

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Re: Gun Safety

Postby KevinLevites » Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:21 pm

Guns have evolved and will continue to evolve as technology evolves. I don't doubt that new electronic safety measures will be installed in guns and offered as a marketing tool to reach people who might otherwise be sketchy about owning them.

As for myself, I'm on the fence about gun ownership. I'm a disabled paramedic with almost 12 years of street experience here in Florida, and I'm not a stranger to the carnage that guns can cause. It's difficult for my to be charitable toward gun ownership when I've seen dead 7 year-olds who played with them when Mommy and/or Daddy wasn't being responsible.

At the same time, a gun is the only thing that really gives a woman (or handicapped person, or elderly person, or whatever) parity with home invaders intent on gang rape while under the influence of drugs.

I have, personally, seen many instances where guns have saved human life.

It's a very confusing, conflicted subject.

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