This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

General discussion on the subject of religion, losing religion, and having no religion to lose...
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby nmblum88 » Sat Dec 03, 2016 2:25 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
nmblum88 burp....hick,, wrote:LOL.. I may have to rest my case:
You don't have a case. You are trolling to seek attention.

nmblum88...hic...burp...pour,pour wrote: Now Matthew, try to keep you tendency to hysterical outbursts to some manageable level.
Norma, numerous times , you have made three posts about me in a row. You are infatuated with me and have no interest in the thread topics. You froth at the mouth and scream "I am taller than you" or "Your father says you are a discrace" and things like that. It's funny, but creepy. :D

nmblum88...hic burp..clink...guzzle.. wrote: And lastly Matthew, this is a Forum, it is not recess at your kindergarten.
Thanks Norma. I came from the Skeptics Annotated Bible forum to the Skeptic Society Forum, because they are forums.

Why you, an 89 year old attention seeker, gets drunk and interrupts Skeptic Forum threads, to tell me your bizarre personal opinions is anyone's guess. :lol:


Matthew, you already ARE an attention seeker, and of of world class proportions.
But I guess that for a bookkeeper that might qualify as a claim to fame.

Who in this forum demands more attention for his interminable blather and boasting than you do??
I haven't looked but I suspect you have more posts in less time on board than anyone else... most of them notable for their lose connection to fact.
And while you are certainly not 89, you are hardly notable for being possessed of anything resembling a glorious (or even normal) youth.
For not only are you middle aged and unattractive in mind and body, you were probably much the same when you at an age where even a hint of male allure might have counted to bolster you self image..
Homely, bad at sports, never chosen for a team, couldn't learn to dance, wasn't invited to the prom: Matthew.
No wonder your mother wanted youth learn to knit: like any concerned parent she wanted you to be good at SOMETHING.
Now, I'll wager that you can knit yourself a pair of elevator shoes.
Do it.

Norma Manna Blum




.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Sat Dec 03, 2016 2:33 am

nmblum88 wrote: Matthew, you already ARE an attention seeker, and of of world class proportions.
But I guess that for a bookkeeper that might qualify as a claim to fame.
Norma calm down. You have just written another three posts about me in a row.

You have worked yourself up into another tizzy and the booze isn't helping. Go to bed, sober up and try make normal posts in the morning.


nmblum88 wrote:Now, I'll wager that you can knit yourself a pair of elevator shoes. Norma Manna Blum
Err...umm...errr.. Thanks Norma, whatever that incoherent insult was... :lol:

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby nmblum88 » Sat Dec 03, 2016 2:51 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
nmblum88 wrote:Sorry: you are much to fragile to continue these ridiculous, mostly repetitive exchanges.

Norma you just posted three posts about me in a row.

I don't know if you are just senile or drunk as a skunk again, but do you really think the members here think I'm fragile? The actual evidence is pointing at you. :lol:

Try sober up and have another go tomorrow.
:D


Of course you don't know.
That's exactly the point: . you are clueless as well a devoid of an iota of self awareness.
Which is why you speak of my senility and my drinking habit with the same dopey aplomb with which you dare to have an opinion on Quantum Mechanics, or the sciences in general.
Off to a concert...now...
Gee, petit Matthew , if you knew anything about music, we COULD discuss semiquavers, come the morrow.
Or coloraturas.
But I guess not.



NMB

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Sat Dec 03, 2016 3:02 am

nmblum88....hic...burp...hic... wrote:[Of course you don't know.
Norma, I have no idea why I need to knit a pair of elevator shoes. You were so drunk last time you forgot that you do not know how tall I am, when you sloshed out you previous drunken insult "I'm taller than you!!!"

How tall am I in centimeters Norma? ( You don't have a clue do you?)
:lol:

nmblum88....hic...burp...hic... wrote:Gee, petit Matthew , if you knew anything about music
I play three instruments, What instrument do you play Norma? :lol:

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Re: Christian believe in "the Christ".

Postby Angel » Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:47 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote: Nice try, but you're Christian. I know it's embarrassing, but you're Christian. :lol:
Angel wrote:Not I. I say God created first man in his own image. Adam from diet & Eve from Adam's rib. What does the things I say have to do with being a Christian ?
You really don't know anything about the Bible at all, do you? "God" made Adam in the Christian ( and Jewish religion). There is no "God" or "Adam or Eve" in any other religion. You are a Christian.

Angel wrote:Especially since Jesus took their sins so they believe they get to go to heaven anyway.
This is going to be hilarious. Now Jesus is also known as "the Christ" and followers of Jesus are called "Christians".

Did it never occur to you for a nano-second that you follow Christ and are therefore a Christian?


I'm not much good at following anybody let
alone become a fan or worship them.
I follow the truth ~ love ~ goodness & mercy
that I become absolutely able. Free.
No labels please. :-)
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:52 pm

If death is silence and silence is golden~
then death is God's golden rule.
How dead are you that you don't
measure up?
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:33 pm

gorgeous wrote:give evidence that God kills...


Myths do not have evidence and the mythical character as written up in scriptures is the one I wish you to judge according to what the bible says.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:35 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:[
The only people who have to worry about your question would be people who think "God" and "Jesus" are real. [/color] :D


I agree but they seem to not like to judge their God even as scriptures tell them to do just that.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:39 pm

Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.

I argue that if we begin by assuming an original (absolute) something, this leads to a contradiction based on Godel's Incompleteness theorem. We cannot have reasoning most complete enough to justify all that 'exists' derives from another something without discovering some things that cannot (like the laws of physics or logic themselves). In contrast, if we begin with absolute nothingness, such a state of 'non-existence' lacks concern to break any 'law' of contradiction because not even laws exist in such an absolute state. Yet, being not even compelled to 'obey' some law that doesn't exist, this does not limit it to do so.

As such, it seems more rational to assume an origin of negation and why it makes better sense that should there be some 'god', it would more rationally be originating out of evil because all else that follows would only be an improvement to his credit.


Interesting logic trail.

If we compare Gods kill record with Satan's who is supposed to be the evil one, then for sure God ends up looking even more evil.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:42 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.......


Hang on Scott. The opening post was pointing out something about fictional people in a fictional story. This only matters to religious people who believe in "God and Jesus".

To us atheists, it is like wondering if Batman uses a Gillette or Wilkinson razor to shave.....It is totally irrelevant and nothing to do with reality.


Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.

Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:49 pm

Angel wrote:God is both good and evil.
Both male and female.
As he made first man both
male and female. One like God.
Adam & Eve ate something and became
like God ~ knowing both good and evil.
Knowing both male and female as they
saw themselves only to see the differences
of being divided into only male and
only female. God dominates naturally.
Adam and Eve had to learn to dominate.

As for killing~ it's not God doing it~ it's
those who have yet to learn how to
dominate gently that kill.
Accidents happen. People are too rushed.
7 billion people is just too much for
one father. lol


I would say that God's dominance is based on evil if he cannot follow the golden rule.

If A & E learned to dominate, they sure did not learn their lesson well as God drove them out of Eden.

Seems that God did not recognize their right to dominate him, as we can, when we write the laws of God in our hearts the way A & E did.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:03 pm

Scott Mayers wrote:Matthew, I would like to actually discuss these with you but here might be off topic. We could do another thread on this in the future.

On "Sacrifice", I have a conjecture theory on this that I posted here a long while ago and began from CFI. It too is rational. In fact, sacrifice was NOT originally for some 'god'. It is a formal arrangement at the temple (another extended theory I have) that deals with assuring contracts. Just for simplicity, it is basically like how gangs might initiate their members by requiring they commit a crime to be sure they demonstrate that 'sacrifice' and binds the group in a stronger faith than even most contracts. They would have done this though in negotiations between tribes or individuals at the temple. If I want to bind a contract with you, we negotiate what is most valuable to me but NOT of significance to your gain and vice versa. Then we sincerely sacrifice in a binding agreement that needs no other formal means other than in the face of 'god' (nature).


Just for your files buddy. I found it all interesting but if you are pressed for time, start it up at the 8 min. mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T64_El2s7FU

I do not think it is the agreement that hold people into their religious groups. It may just be pride and a desire to not admit that they have wasted or been conned into making such sacrifices for the wrong reasons.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Lausten » Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:06 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.......


Hang on Scott. The opening post was pointing out something about fictional people in a fictional story. This only matters to religious people who believe in "God and Jesus".

To us atheists, it is like wondering if Batman uses a Gillette or Wilkinson razor to shave.....It is totally irrelevant and nothing to do with reality.


Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.

Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.

Regards
DL

There is something seriously wrong with you GB. you ask a question about the internal consistency of the Bible, then when someone says they don't care, you say they don't care about others who are completely external to the question. You are trying to solve a problem with reason from inside a place where reason does not exist.
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Wed Dec 07, 2016 8:07 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Angel wrote:God is both good and evil.
Both male and female.
As he made first man both
male and female. One like God.
Adam & Eve ate something and became
like God ~ knowing both good and evil.
Knowing both male and female as they
saw themselves only to see the differences
of being divided into only male and
only female. God dominates naturally.
Adam and Eve had to learn to dominate.

As for killing~ it's not God doing it~ it's
those who have yet to learn how to
dominate gently that kill.
Accidents happen. People are too rushed.
7 billion people is just too much for
one father. lol


I would say that God's dominance is based on evil if he cannot follow the golden rule.

God does not dominate ~ that authority was given to A & E.
Many use God to dominate things they
shouldn't be dominating. His will ~ after all~
is willing and able.
Good luck with the golden rule thing ~
people don't often return kindness
with kindness anymore.
If A & E learned to dominate, they sure did not learn their lesson well as God drove them out of Eden.

Has anybody ever really rearmed
their lessons yet? I am to teach that
love is innocent and learn that love
is trust but in this world it's not easy.


Seems that God did not recognize their right to dominate him, as we can, when we write the laws of God in our hearts the way A & E did.

We don't dominate him and he don't
dominate us. You can choose to give
God your power and authority here on
earth. I'm hoping that when enough
people give God the authority ~ he will
just take over. :-D




Regards
DL
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Did my babies arise from Hades?
Do I have the keys?
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Scott Mayers » Wed Dec 07, 2016 8:34 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:Matthew, I would like to actually discuss these with you but here might be off topic. We could do another thread on this in the future.

On "Sacrifice", I have a conjecture theory on this that I posted here a long while ago and began from CFI. It too is rational. In fact, sacrifice was NOT originally for some 'god'. It is a formal arrangement at the temple (another extended theory I have) that deals with assuring contracts. Just for simplicity, it is basically like how gangs might initiate their members by requiring they commit a crime to be sure they demonstrate that 'sacrifice' and binds the group in a stronger faith than even most contracts. They would have done this though in negotiations between tribes or individuals at the temple. If I want to bind a contract with you, we negotiate what is most valuable to me but NOT of significance to your gain and vice versa. Then we sincerely sacrifice in a binding agreement that needs no other formal means other than in the face of 'god' (nature).


Just for your files buddy. I found it all interesting but if you are pressed for time, start it up at the 8 min. mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T64_El2s7FU

I do not think it is the agreement that hold people into their religious groups. It may just be pride and a desire to not admit that they have wasted or been conned into making such sacrifices for the wrong reasons.

Regards
DL

Yes, and this is what make sacrifice (appropriately as real sacrifices, not just superficial gestures of this symbolically) powerful.
I eat without fear of certain Death from The Tree of Knowledge because with wisdom, we may one day break free from its mortal curse.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Sun Dec 11, 2016 9:32 pm

Lausten wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.......


Hang on Scott. The opening post was pointing out something about fictional people in a fictional story. This only matters to religious people who believe in "God and Jesus".

To us atheists, it is like wondering if Batman uses a Gillette or Wilkinson razor to shave.....It is totally irrelevant and nothing to do with reality.


Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.

Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.

Regards
DL

There is something seriously wrong with you GB. you ask a question about the internal consistency of the Bible, then when someone says they don't care, you say they don't care about others who are completely external to the question. You are trying to solve a problem with reason from inside a place where reason does not exist.


For the evils of religions to grow, all good atheists, as well as other good people need do, is nothing.

If you do not get that then your thinking has something seriously wrong with it.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Sun Dec 11, 2016 10:58 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.
I cannot use evidence about how evil the fictional god is, in an argument....and simultaneously state that evidence source is, itself, fictional. That would simply further muddy the waters.


Gnostic Bishop wrote:Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.
No. That's not right. I totally support "neighbours helping neighbours for the better results that come from co-operation." as that is economically and socially rational. I don't need to fight religion but rather I need to fight irrational people (some of whom use religion to support their irrational behaviour)

Simultaneously, I cannot tell people what they should or should not believe. It is their right to believe anything they want as long as it doesn't interfere with other people or a rationally evolving society.


(I do not "go to religious forums" and spam skeptic and scientific facts. That just doesn't work or help. If you flip the coin you can see the religious nutcases spamming on our science and skeptical forum......and we just laugh at them. Rational behaviour will slowly come naturally with pragmatic things like finding food, curing illness, paying off mortgages and things like that)

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Mon Dec 12, 2016 12:14 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.
I cannot use evidence about how evil the fictional god is, in an argument....and simultaneously state that evidence source is, itself, fictional. That would simply further muddy the waters.

]


Yet children can when they read fairy tales.

Oh well.

As to your --- "Rational behaviour will slowly come naturally", then go ahead and wait till a gay in your family is murdered for being gay or one of the women in your family has to take another job because she is paid less than a man for the same work.

That will be a great time for you to do your duty to society.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Mon Dec 12, 2016 12:37 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote: Yet children can when they read fairy tales.
Are you suggesting we ban fairy tales and make religion illegal? Good luck with that.

Gnostic Bishop wrote:As to your --- "Rational behaviour will slowly come naturally", then go ahead and wait till a gay in your family is murdered for being gay or one of the women in your family has to take another job because she is paid less than a man for the same work.
....or get thrown out of France for being Huguenots, four hundred years ago.....

The aim is to make laws that protect all humans against tangible crimes. The aim is not to command other people how to think about religion or other social policies. You can educate people in general, so they may choose a better policy, but you can't dictate what they think.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Mon Dec 12, 2016 3:33 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote: Yet children can when they read fairy tales.
Are you suggesting we ban fairy tales and make religion illegal? Good luck with that.

Gnostic Bishop wrote:As to your --- "Rational behaviour will slowly come naturally", then go ahead and wait till a gay in your family is murdered for being gay or one of the women in your family has to take another job because she is paid less than a man for the same work.
....or get thrown out of France for being Huguenots, four hundred years ago.....

The aim is to make laws that protect all humans against tangible crimes. The aim is not to command other people how to think about religion or other social policies. You can educate people in general, so they may choose a better policy, but you can't dictate what they think.


"You can educate people in general,"

If we cannot educate people, then we should close all schools. Yours was quite the foolish statement

It is true that you cannot change minds by hiding under a bush and doing nothing.

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DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Lausten » Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:11 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
For the evils of religions to grow, all good atheists, as well as other good people need do, is nothing.

If you do not get that then your thinking has something seriously wrong with it.

Regards
DL

I completely get that. It's not even difficult. It's practically common knowledge.

But you aren't saying "do something", you aren't even asking "what should be done".

What you are saying is, "Do exactly as I do. Agree with me. Think like me. My reasoning is sound and your's is not."

The "Bishop" part of your name fits you perfectly.
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:50 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote: "You can educate people in general,"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:If we cannot educate people, then we should close all schools. Yours was quite the foolish statement
Well No. My statement is accurate. You haven't actually offered any rebuttal to my statement.

Considering humans are 195,000 years old and mass public education is 150 years old, the process of education is just starting. We are educating against 5,000 year old religious nonsense.

The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:51 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.


It just encourages folks to find a better god. Indeed, the early history of Judaism could be framed that way.

You say Yahweh is evil, but compared to those other gods (such as Moloch), he's a sweetie pie. :mrgreen:
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:42 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Lausten wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.......


Hang on Scott. The opening post was pointing out something about fictional people in a fictional story. This only matters to religious people who believe in "God and Jesus".

To us atheists, it is like wondering if Batman uses a Gillette or Wilkinson razor to shave.....It is totally irrelevant and nothing to do with reality.


Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.

Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.

Regards
DL

There is something seriously wrong with you GB. you ask a question about the internal consistency of the Bible, then when someone says they don't care, you say they don't care about others who are completely external to the question. You are trying to solve a problem with reason from inside a place where reason does not exist.


For the evils of religions to grow, all good atheists, as well as other good people need do, is nothing.

If you do not get that then your thinking has something seriously wrong with it.

Regards
DL


Are they good people doing nothing or
not so good people doing nothing?
Not all people are good ~ I have yet to
meet a good person. Even Jesus couldn't
say he was good. If we were good ~ we
wouldn't be here.
*~ •~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*
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Did my babies arise from Hades?
Do I have the keys?
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:51 pm

With such diversity in society because
of over populating the world ~ is it
even possible to do unto others anymore?
I'm not into the a typical sexual behaviour
of most people (pump off & run away).
Especially people who desire anal sex.
I didn't desire it yet I got it.
My daughter did not desire it yet it
happened to her. My neighbor didn't
desire it yet she got it too.
Do unto others? Hmm
Can we do it back? No!

Oh ok ~ sorry I do not have the quality
of tech devices that allow me to put
everything in one post.

So this golden rule.
Maybe it's supposed to be that if
a person does something to you~ no
matter what it is ~ you have to do it
back to them to cancel the sin? If you
don't do it back it creates disease. Etc...

Or you can learn to heal. LoL
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They say Scorpio is ruled by Pluto.
Did my babies arise from Hades?
Do I have the keys?
Inquiring minds are too afraid to inquire.

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busterggi
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby busterggi » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:04 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.


It just encourages folks to find a better god. Indeed, the early history of Judaism could be framed that way.

You say Yahweh is evil, but compared to those other gods (such as Moloch), he's a sweetie pie. :mrgreen:



Yeah? Ask the Moabites, Amelites, etc whom the bible says he ordered his people to exterminate.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:15 pm

Lausten wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
For the evils of religions to grow, all good atheists, as well as other good people need do, is nothing.

If you do not get that then your thinking has something seriously wrong with it.

Regards
DL

I completely get that. It's not even difficult. It's practically common knowledge.

But you aren't saying "do something", you aren't even asking "what should be done".

What you are saying is, "Do exactly as I do. Agree with me. Think like me. My reasoning is sound and your's is not."

The "Bishop" part of your name fits you perfectly.


I do not push my methods as most do not have my personality. I push any action against evil you decide to do.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:18 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote: "You can educate people in general,"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:If we cannot educate people, then we should close all schools. Yours was quite the foolish statement
Well No. My statement is accurate. You haven't actually offered any rebuttal to my statement.

Considering humans are 195,000 years old and mass public education is 150 years old, the process of education is just starting. We are educating against 5,000 year old religious nonsense.

The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.


The belief is in a good God. Showing that belief to be false is hardly reinforcing religion.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:21 pm

Angel wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Lausten wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:
Scott Mayers wrote:I used a similar kind of reasoning minus the moral valued concept. AND, this was for whether we come from absolutely nothing or a something.......


Hang on Scott. The opening post was pointing out something about fictional people in a fictional story. This only matters to religious people who believe in "God and Jesus".

To us atheists, it is like wondering if Batman uses a Gillette or Wilkinson razor to shave.....It is totally irrelevant and nothing to do with reality.


Tell that to all the gays and women who have been denied equality thanks to their belief that God is good even when their own bible shows just how evil he is.

Seems your reality does not include loving your neighbor as you ignore the damage that religions do to so many.

Regards
DL

There is something seriously wrong with you GB. you ask a question about the internal consistency of the Bible, then when someone says they don't care, you say they don't care about others who are completely external to the question. You are trying to solve a problem with reason from inside a place where reason does not exist.


For the evils of religions to grow, all good atheists, as well as other good people need do, is nothing.

If you do not get that then your thinking has something seriously wrong with it.

Regards
DL


Are they good people doing nothing or
not so good people doing nothing?
Not all people are good ~ I have yet to
meet a good person. Even Jesus couldn't
say he was good. If we were good ~ we
wouldn't be here.


Strange that you do not know any good people. Oh well.

If good people would not be here, where would they be?

Regards
DL

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Gnostic Bishop
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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:24 pm

Angel wrote:With such diversity in society because
of over populating the world ~ is it
even possible to do unto others anymore?
I'm not into the a typical sexual behaviour
of most people (pump off & run away).
Especially people who desire anal sex.
I didn't desire it yet I got it.
My daughter did not desire it yet it
happened to her. My neighbor didn't
desire it yet she got it too.
Do unto others? Hmm
Can we do it back? No!

Oh ok ~ sorry I do not have the quality
of tech devices that allow me to put
everything in one post.

So this golden rule.
Maybe it's supposed to be that if
a person does something to you~ no
matter what it is ~ you have to do it
back to them to cancel the sin? If you
don't do it back it creates disease. Etc...

Or you can learn to heal. LoL


Sin does not cancel sin. It just adds to the number.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Dec 13, 2016 10:46 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.
Gnostic Bishop wrote:The belief is in a good God. Showing that belief to be false is hardly reinforcing religion.
Your position would be predicated on religious people thinking the fictional "God" is only a good "God". However, that's not the case. "God" threatens to burn people in hell for not conforming. "God" wipes out all creatures on Earth in the flood. Religious people see the fictional "God" as complex and doing such wise things that ordinary mortals cannot understand his actions.

If you take the view that religions arose, in part, to explain real natural events that occur in the real world, then it is silly to use their own fictional narratives as evidence to argue against the same religion.

Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.

"God works in mysterious ways"

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Tue Dec 13, 2016 11:51 pm

busterggi wrote:
Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.


It just encourages folks to find a better god. Indeed, the early history of Judaism could be framed that way.

You say Yahweh is evil, but compared to those other gods (such as Moloch), he's a sweetie pie. :mrgreen:



Yeah? Ask the Moabites, Amelites, etc whom the bible says he ordered his people to exterminate.


You really believe in the existence of Nobodaddy, even though you hate Him?

Otherwise your attitude makes no sense. :pr:
Scientists don't know everything, therefore my favorite flavor of stoopidz is true.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:49 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:The fact you use evidence from the behaviour of a fictional "God" to argue against religion is just reinforcing that same ridiculous belief system.
Gnostic Bishop wrote:The belief is in a good God. Showing that belief to be false is hardly reinforcing religion.
Your position would be predicated on religious people thinking the fictional "God" is only a good "God". However, that's not the case. "God" threatens to burn people in hell for not conforming. "God" wipes out all creatures on Earth in the flood. Religious people see the fictional "God" as complex and doing such wise things that ordinary mortals cannot understand his actions.

If you take the view that religions arose, in part, to explain real natural events that occur in the real world, then it is silly to use their own fictional narratives as evidence to argue against the same religion.

Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.

"God works in mysterious ways"


I agree that the religious are delusional.

So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?

Is helping them not the same as following the golden rule?

If you had a delusion that caused harm to others, would you not want to be helped out of it?

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 15, 2016 12:37 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.
"God works in mysterious ways"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:I agree that the religious are delusional. So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?
You are arguing that fictional religious narratives are good evidence to use against other fictional religious narratives. That hasn't worked for 2,500 years.

It is better to drop any connection to religion and let people fully replace religious philosophy with the rational scientific explanation.

If you don't do that we will still be arguing "How many Angels can logically dance on a pin?" or "Can God make a stone so heavy God can't lift it?". That would be a complete waste of time.
:D

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Thu Dec 15, 2016 12:45 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:[
The only people who have to worry about your question would be people who think "God" and "Jesus" are real. [/color] :D


I agree but they seem to not like to judge their God even as scriptures tell them to do just that.

Regards
DL

Truth judges all harshly.
I use the truth.
I use it to judge all fairly. :-)
*~ •~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*
They say Scorpio is ruled by Pluto.
Did my babies arise from Hades?
Do I have the keys?
Inquiring minds are too afraid to inquire.

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:49 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.
"God works in mysterious ways"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:I agree that the religious are delusional. So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?
You are arguing that fictional religious narratives are good evidence to use against other fictional religious narratives. That hasn't worked for 2,500 years.

It is better to drop any connection to religion and let people fully replace religious philosophy with the rational scientific explanation.

If you don't do that we will still be arguing "How many Angels can logically dance on a pin?" or "Can God make a stone so heavy God can't lift it?". That would be a complete waste of time.
:D


A religious belief is not fiction to the believer and to call him delusional just kills any effort to show him that what he believes is immoral.

Arguments about the realty of his god is a dead end. A moral argument he might discuss.

You go ahead and do your thing and I will do mine.

Regards
DL

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Re: This is incontrovertible proof that God is evil. God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:51 pm

Angel wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:[
The only people who have to worry about your question would be people who think "God" and "Jesus" are real. [/color] :D


I agree but they seem to not like to judge their God even as scriptures tell them to do just that.

Regards
DL

Truth judges all harshly.
I use the truth.
I use it to judge all fairly. :-)


All judgements are subjective, so is harshness.

Regards
DL

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God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:00 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.
"God works in mysterious ways"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:I agree that the religious are delusional. So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?
Matthew Ellard wrote:You are arguing that fictional religious narratives are good evidence to use against other fictional religious narratives. That hasn't worked for 2,500 years. It is better to drop any connection to religion and let people fully replace religious philosophy with the rational scientific explanation. If you don't do that we will still be arguing "How many Angels can logically dance on a pin?" or "Can God make a stone so heavy God can't lift it?". That would be a complete waste of time. :D

Gnostic Bishop wrote:A religious belief is not fiction to the believer and to call him delusional just kills any effort to show him that what he believes is immoral.
It is a fiction to the religious person. If two religious idiots can argue about "how many angels can dance on a pin" and both remain religious, then that is clear evidence that you plan to show that "God" is a wicked person simply does not work and has not worked.

Gnostic Bishop wrote:You go ahead and do your thing and I will do mine.
Well here is a perfect opportunity for you to show your theory working in action. Angel, who is trolling in this thread is a Christian and posts quotes from the Bible here as "the truth". Start a discussion with Angel and show her that her "God" is evil. :lol:

You won't make a dent. Angel will simply go into her defensive mode and say "God works in mysterious ways". Indeed most members here have put Angel on ignore, because Angel cannot respond in a logical manner and is unable to see any paradoxes in her Biblical "God". She simply ignores those arguments.

Gnostic Bishop and Angel : The debate starts now.........

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Re: God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Angel » Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:09 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.
"God works in mysterious ways"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:I agree that the religious are delusional. So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?
Matthew Ellard wrote:You are arguing that fictional religious narratives are good evidence to use against other fictional religious narratives. That hasn't worked for 2,500 years. It is better to drop any connection to religion and let people fully replace religious philosophy with the rational scientific explanation. If you don't do that we will still be arguing "How many Angels can logically dance on a pin?" or "Can God make a stone so heavy God can't lift it?". That would be a complete waste of time. :D

Gnostic Bishop wrote:A religious belief is not fiction to the believer and to call him delusional just kills any effort to show him that what he believes is immoral.
It is a fiction to the religious person. If two religious idiots can argue about "how many angels can dance on a pin" and both remain religious, then that is clear evidence that you plan to show that "God" is a wicked person simply does not work and has not worked.

Gnostic Bishop wrote:You go ahead and do your thing and I will do mine.
Well here is a perfect opportunity for you to show your theory working in action. Angel, who is trolling in this thread is a Christian and posts quotes from the Bible here as "the truth". Start a discussion with Angel and show her that her "God" is evil. :lol:

You won't make a dent. Angel will simply go into her defensive mode and say "God works in mysterious ways". Indeed most members here have put Angel on ignore, because Angel cannot respond in a logical manner and is unable to see any paradoxes in her Biblical "God". She simply ignores those arguments.

Gnostic Bishop and Angel : The debate starts now.........


Do u expect me to entertain ur meanness ?
It will cost u. Mwahahaha
*~ •~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*~•~*
They say Scorpio is ruled by Pluto.
Did my babies arise from Hades?
Do I have the keys?
Inquiring minds are too afraid to inquire.

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Re: God does not live by his own golden rule.

Postby Gnostic Bishop » Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:53 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote:Christians already have a defense mechanism to hand wave that argument away.
"God works in mysterious ways"

Gnostic Bishop wrote:I agree that the religious are delusional. So why would you not want to help rid them of their delusional thinking, given the damage that that is doing to society?
Matthew Ellard wrote:You are arguing that fictional religious narratives are good evidence to use against other fictional religious narratives. That hasn't worked for 2,500 years. It is better to drop any connection to religion and let people fully replace religious philosophy with the rational scientific explanation. If you don't do that we will still be arguing "How many Angels can logically dance on a pin?" or "Can God make a stone so heavy God can't lift it?". That would be a complete waste of time. :D

Gnostic Bishop wrote:A religious belief is not fiction to the believer and to call him delusional just kills any effort to show him that what he believes is immoral.
It is a fiction to the religious person. If two religious idiots can argue about "how many angels can dance on a pin" and both remain religious, then that is clear evidence that you plan to show that "God" is a wicked person simply does not work and has not worked.

Gnostic Bishop wrote:You go ahead and do your thing and I will do mine.
Well here is a perfect opportunity for you to show your theory working in action. Angel, who is trolling in this thread is a Christian and posts quotes from the Bible here as "the truth". Start a discussion with Angel and show her that her "God" is evil. :lol:

You won't make a dent. Angel will simply go into her defensive mode and say "God works in mysterious ways". Indeed most members here have put Angel on ignore, because Angel cannot respond in a logical manner and is unable to see any paradoxes in her Biblical "God". She simply ignores those arguments.
]


You are correct and that is why I post more for the lurkers than for her.

People will see how poorly she apologises for her God and that is good enough for me.

Every time she shows her inability, that is a dent, hopefully, into an undecided lurker.

Regards
DL


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