Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

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Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:15 pm

I hear by the grapevine that a Democratic representative has filed official papers requesting the Justice Department to provide information on various matters possibly relevant to impeachment.

Surely this is a non-starter at this point. The House leadership (Republican) is not yet in any hurry to get rid of Trump, and will undoubtedly squelch it. So the purpose must be simply to embarrass them by forcing them to do it.

What do others think? Am I missing anything here?
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:21 pm

Setting a precedent most likely.

And for you non-USians, impeachment is the first step to removal. When the Presidentish is impeached by the House of Representatives he'll be tried by the Senate.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:08 pm

I think it simply "sets the stage" so that Trumps enemies can start thinking about it. And by enemies: I mean his allies and supporters that grow tired of him........ and/or most probably: Big Business Interests that have no need for Trump and for whom Trump is mostly jealous or dismissive. He stocks his admin with Wall Street..... but he has said too much against them. Trump doesn't "like them" but he thinks he can use them. ............. and vice versa.

Its all a recipe for impeachment with the Dem's being a solid block. The other solid block would be the pro-Pence people....the Religious Nut Base.

The thing about electing a radical....which the Power in Place Pukes didn't want to do in the first place........ is you got a radical.

Makes for good TV though.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:38 pm

My new bumpersticker says "This is YOUR fault." with a GOP logo.

Your.Fault.GOP.JPG
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby TJrandom » Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:49 pm

So if impeached and convicted for High Crimes and Misdemeanours - does that automatically elevate Pence, or can congress elect anyone?

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:52 pm

TJrandom wrote:So if impeached and convicted for High Crimes and Misdemeanours - does that automatically elevate Pence, or can congress elect anyone?

There is a set order of succession. Pence would be the President. I think he can select his own VP, however.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby TJrandom » Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:55 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
TJrandom wrote:So if impeached and convicted for High Crimes and Misdemeanours - does that automatically elevate Pence, or can congress elect anyone?

There is a set order of succession. Pence would be the President. ...


That holds for impeachments? It makes sense for assassinations, but Pence as President might actually be worse than Trump.

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:17 pm

TJrandom wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
TJrandom wrote:So if impeached and convicted for High Crimes and Misdemeanours - does that automatically elevate Pence, or can congress elect anyone?

There is a set order of succession. Pence would be the President. ...


That holds for impeachments? It makes sense for assassinations, but Pence as President might actually be worse than Trump.
It holds for convictions. Remember that impeachment is just the first step.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:38 pm

TJrandom wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
TJrandom wrote:So if impeached and convicted for High Crimes and Misdemeanours - does that automatically elevate Pence, or can congress elect anyone?

There is a set order of succession. Pence would be the President. ...


That holds for impeachments? It makes sense for assassinations, but Pence as President might actually be worse than Trump.



There's no "might" about it. Pence is worse than Trump because his insanity is ideological and not cynical, like Trump's. Trump is simply an egomaniac, not committed to any program except opportunism. He as much as said so at one point, saying years ago that he'd be a Republican candidate because only the Republicans would be stupid enough to nominate him. But Pence wants to establish a Rule of the Saints. He'd like to drive women back into back-alley abortions, gay people back into the closet, and non-Christians (except possibly Jews) out onto an ice floe.

Whenever the vice-presidency becomes vacant, the President is to nominate a new vice-President, subject to confirmation by the Senate. This has happened only twice: In 1972, when Spiro Agnew was forced to resign as VP, due to financial scandal---remember the days when a financial scandal actually brought about the downfall of a politician? So long ago (sigh!)---and Gerald Ford was appointed the new Vice President. Then, when Nixon resigned in 1974 and Ford became President (the only President in history never elected to national office), he nominated Nelson Rockefeller, who managed to survive the remainder of Ford's term in office, before succumbing to a heart attack in the arms of his mistress.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:40 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:My new bumpersticker says "This is YOUR fault." with a GOP logo.

Your.Fault.GOP.JPG



I like it. How can I get me one of those?
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:45 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:My new bumpersticker says "This is YOUR fault." with a GOP logo.

Your.Fault.GOP.JPG



I like it. How can I get me one of those?
I made it at buildasign.com. You can save that image and upload it to their site. They'll send you a bumpersticker version.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Gord » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:57 am

Upton_O_Goode wrote:...saying years ago that he'd be a Republican candidate because only the Republicans would be stupid enough to nominate him....

Probably not true: http://www.snopes.com/1998-trump-people-quote/
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby scrmbldggs » Sat Feb 11, 2017 3:12 am

...but apparently he said this

Spoiler:
Image

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Sat Feb 11, 2017 12:58 pm

Gord wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:...saying years ago that he'd be a Republican candidate because only the Republicans would be stupid enough to nominate him....

Probably not true: http://www.snopes.com/1998-trump-people-quote/


Yes, I should have checked that again. Something in the back of my mind told me it wasn't a solid quote. My mistake.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Sat Feb 11, 2017 6:01 pm

Ummmmmm..... he "could have" said it. Its one of those truths whether uttered or not.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby TJrandom » Sat Feb 11, 2017 6:33 pm

An alternate fact?

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Sat Feb 11, 2017 6:49 pm

HA!---Exactly so. Fits right into Trumps world?...................................... How ironic and appropriate.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:20 pm

bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:HA!---Exactly so. Fits right into Trumps world?...................................... How ironic and appropriate.


I never thought about that. Why should I be bothered by the mere fact that there is no evidence for what I said? That's not the new world of political discourse that we have now entered upon. So, I'm going to insist that he DID say it. At least, he should have done.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:52 pm

Upton: did I rag on you before about being sarcastic in using "synonymous?" You or not, I apologize. I was "right" but too grumpy.

Some days are like that.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:02 pm

Oh never mind that! Like I said, I'm not thin-skinned. And I enjoy reading your posts. Feel free to mock me when I screw up.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:05 pm

Well, thing is.......you were right. Ain't that a kick? Both right?????

How can that be?

....................................... and the answer as usual is timing and context.

But I'll shorthand it: sarcasm gets stuck too easily in the intertubes. You have to be "well known" to provide the context that you are a cunning linguist making a joke rather than a dolt being an idiot.

....................... mind the gap.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Poodle » Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:06 pm

Bobbo is grumpy only on days containing a Y. So learn Dutch and Bobbo's a pussy cat.

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:07 pm

I resemble that remark.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:46 pm

I haven't been on this board long enough for my really snarky side to show up. Wait till some day when I'm not in a good mood, and then----WATCH OUT!
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby scrmbldggs » Sun Feb 12, 2017 4:25 pm

Grabbed this from tha WaPo (re impeachment @ min 5:55-ish)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDqA7veCWns

(For the record, Article 2, Section 4 of the Constitution says: The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors. )

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby OlegTheBatty » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:53 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:I haven't been on this board long enough for my really snarky side to show up. Wait till some day when I'm not in a good mood, and then----WATCH OUT!


My snark is at its most creative when I am in a good mood. I look forward to seeing yours.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Poodle » Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:03 pm

"Just the place for a Snark!" the Bellman cried,
As he landed his crew with care;
Supporting each man on the top of the tide
By a finger entwined in his hair.

"Just the place for a Snark! I have said it twice:
That alone should encourage the crew.
Just the place for a Snark! I have said it thrice:
What I tell you three times is true."

...
...
...

In the midst of the word he was trying to say,
In the midst of his laughter and glee,
He had softly and suddenly vanished away—
For the Snark was a Boojum, you see.

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby scrmbldggs » Mon Feb 13, 2017 2:47 am

As so often, you're again on top of things. :-P

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby ahhell » Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:42 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:I hear by the grapevine that a Democratic representative has filed official papers requesting the Justice Department to provide information on various matters possibly relevant to impeachment.

Surely this is a non-starter at this point. The House leadership (Republican) is not yet in any hurry to get rid of Trump, and will undoubtedly squelch it. So the purpose must be simply to embarrass them by forcing them to do it.

What do others think? Am I missing anything here?
They're doing this for the same reason Republicans voted to repeal ACA umpteen times will Obama was POTUS, to show the base that they were doing something when in reality they weren't.

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:59 pm

ahhell wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:I hear by the grapevine that a Democratic representative has filed official papers requesting the Justice Department to provide information on various matters possibly relevant to impeachment.

Surely this is a non-starter at this point. The House leadership (Republican) is not yet in any hurry to get rid of Trump, and will undoubtedly squelch it. So the purpose must be simply to embarrass them by forcing them to do it.

What do others think? Am I missing anything here?
They're doing this for the same reason Republicans voted to repeal ACA umpteen times will Obama was POTUS, to show the base that they were doing something when in reality they weren't.



Yes, I think in both cases, the ultimate aim was to make the opposition party OWN the thing, whether ACA or Trump.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:16 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Yes, I think in both cases, the ultimate aim was to make the opposition party OWN the thing, whether ACA or Trump.

Synonymously, the point is the opposite. Its about making the out of power party "look like" they are still fighting the good fight..... when they aren't. Its called Kabuki Theater. (Weird, foreign, nonsensical and boring.... except to those who are wholly captured.)
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Mon Feb 13, 2017 9:41 pm

bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:Yes, I think in both cases, the ultimate aim was to make the opposition party OWN the thing, whether ACA or Trump.

Synonymously, the point is the opposite. Its about making the out of power party "look like" they are still fighting the good fight..... when they aren't. Its called Kabuki Theater. (Weird, foreign, nonsensical and boring.... except to those who are wholly captured.)



Well, the two things are symmetric. I agree it's mostly about appearances and maintaining the appearance of opposition. But that has the effect of shifting all the responsibility to the other side.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Feb 14, 2017 12:57 am

Victory has a thousand fathers but defeat is an orphan. Both sides manipulating the public for the perception of victory.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby JO 753 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 12:50 pm

WUT 1 MaN RiTS, U TRILYN MA RED OVR U MILYN SeNCUREZ.
http://www.nooalf.com

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby JO 753 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:53 pm

Another big reazon to impeach him:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiZqFGLAeAc
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby TJrandom » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:48 am

I knew this, and so did many, many more.

Mental health professionals warn Trump is incapable of being president


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 78831.html

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby JO 753 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:01 pm

Art of the Deal gost riter will not be on the list uv karakter witnessez for the defens.
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Tom Palven » Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:31 am

TJrandom wrote:I knew this, and so did many, many more.

Mental health professionals warn Trump is incapable of being president


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 78831.html


"The rule is perfect: In all matters of opinion our adversaries are insane."-- Mark Twain

http://www.finedictionary.com/adversary.html
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:51 pm

Tom Palven wrote:
TJrandom wrote:I knew this, and so did many, many more.

Mental health professionals warn Trump is incapable of being president


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 78831.html


"The rule is perfect: In all matters of opinion our adversaries are insane."-- Mark Twain

http://www.finedictionary.com/adversary.html



As you posted the quotation without much explanation of it, I'm left wondering what you are implying. Perhaps you could clarify it a bit. First, let me explain what I'm after.

A quotation may be an eloquent way of expressing a conclusion. It is NOT an argument for that conclusion.

What does Mark Twain's statement mean? Does it mean that people will charge their political adversaries with insanity, whether or not they are insane? if so, it is false on the face of it. Political arguments have been going on very steadily for centuries, yet accusations of insanity have been rare. I'm guessing he meant that people find it so difficult to understand political opinions they find uncongenial that IN THEIR OWN MINDS, they secretly consign their adversaries to the ranks of the insane. On that basis, or even on the stronger basis that people make the public accusation of insanity for no other reason than their own reluctance to consider it seriously---even if such is the case---the question whether the adversary actually IS insane is left open.

This quotation may be a nice thought-saving device, allowing some people to dismiss out of hand the evidence of Trump's insanity without actually looking at it. It does not make that mountain of evidence go away. Just consider:

What other male running for public office in the whole history of the human race, ever stood in front of a large audience and boasted of the size of his penis?

What other US politician ever suggested "going after" the innocent families of terrorists?

What other US politician ever suggested repudiating the national debt as a way of handling it?

What other US politician ever suggested printing enough paper money to pay off the national debt?

What other politician flew into a rage and sent his press officer out to deny the videotaped evidence of the size of the crowd at his inauguration?

What other politician had a photograph of that crowd cropped to make it appear larger, then hung it on his wall, and proclaimed it to the whole world?

What other President flew into a rage when asked an innocent question about anti-semitic incidents in the country, screamed at the questioner, called him a liar, then went into a tirade having nothing to do with the question?

These, and about 100 other incidents I can personally recall, are more than a prima facie case for insanity. Anyone who wishes to deny the claim is faced with the burden of proof.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

― H.L. Mencken, On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe

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ElectricMonk
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Re: Preliminary Step Toward Impeachment?

Postby ElectricMonk » Mon Feb 20, 2017 5:14 pm

Without proper examination and tests, we can't tell if Trump is mentally ill in any clinical sense. And it is true that calling those you disagree with insane has a very troubled history.

Instead of considering him insane, let's think of him as a massively uniformed individual who self-educated through bogus news shows and bad TV and movies. As a TV celebrity, he makes sense of the world in terms of TV ratings, and shows like 24 (which make torture look right) had many viewers.

If you knew next to nothing about the Middle East Peace process, and someone asks you about the one-state or two-state solution, what would you say? Or about a Russian ship off the coast? Wouldn't shooting it down seem like the reasonable thing to do for someone who grew up in the Cold War? Isn't that what TV presidents do?
Trump is just completely out of his depth and clings to the one thing he believes he can do:
keep his ratings up.

And if his TV image is threatened by looking small in comparison to Obama, the logical ting for him is to deny, counterattack, anything to stay in the headlines, because that is all that matters:

Tune in to the next Trump tirade, and let us know if you were entertained.
"As private parts to the gods are we! They play with us for their sport. "
- Lord Melchett, Blackadder II


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