A Peace Conspiracy

Who else knows what we know, Jerry?
Tom Palven
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It's Looking More and More Like Matt is an ASIS Troll

Post by Tom Palven » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:42 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:27 am
Tom Palven wrote: Isn't claiming that saying "Bolton should remain out of Iran" is the same as saying "The US shouldn't restore economic sanctions on Iran" a stretch, Austin?
Austin was my friend, who caught you changing your BS claim from "The Fourth Reich Vichy Puppet government of Afghanistan" to "The Vichy puppet government of Afghanistan" to the "puppet government of Afghanistan". You then lied and pretended you hadn't changed anything.
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=27640&p=668724&hilit=Vichy#p668724

I assume, he like me, doesn't believe you actually know where Afghanistan is. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Why do you lie so much Tom Palven?
Yogi bear 7.jpg

I stand by "Vichy Fourth Reich puppet government of Afghanistan" as an accurate description, but think that it may be unnecessarily wordy.

A big problem that has you neoconservatives in fits is that South Korea no longer has a Vichy-type government that loves US occupation and quickly responds to all Fourth Reich carrots and/or sticks.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:08 am

Tom Palven wrote: I stand by "Vichy Fourth Reich puppet government of Afghanistan" as an accurate description,
That's because you are a complete idiot. :lol: :lol:

The Third Reich was the German government in Germany. There was no Fourth Reich government of Germany.

The German occupation government of Northern France did not occupy Southern France as Germany did not have enough manpower to occupy all of France. The Germans imposed Otto von Stülpnagel as governor.

The French government of South France was not an occupation government but a French government that resided in a French town called Vichy. "Vichy" is not a type of government. It is a French city..

The current government of Afghanistan was elected by the citizens of Afghanistan. NATO did not place any governor in Kabul, nor can you name one. The last election was only two weeks ago.

You really shouldn't post after sundown when your senility makes your posts nonsensical. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Yogi bear 5.jpg
Yogi bear 6.jpg
Yogi bear 7.jpg
Tom Palven, in essence, you are an uneducated Trump supporter, two days before the mid term elections, desperate to post Fox News propaganda to keep you beloved right wing in power. Suck eggs.

I have caught you copying holocaust denial propaganda on this forum. "Hitler was really a socialist like you" Next time you do that I will invite the anti-holocaust denial historians to join the debate, including those who live in Florida. :D
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Seems Matt Really is an ASIS Stooge

Post by Tom Palven » Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:12 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:08 am

Tom Palven, in essence, you are an uneducated Trump supporter, two days before the mid term elections, desperate to post Fox News propaganda to keep you beloved right wing in power. Suck eggs.

I have caught you copying holocaust denial propaganda on this forum. "Hitler was really a socialist like you" Next time you do that I will invite the anti-holocaust denial historians to join the debate, including those who live in Florida. :D
I don't give a leapin' lap dance who you invite, but why haven't you asked these associates to jump in here before now?

At times you claim that as an Australian you know hardly anything about US politics, but then you are concerned that the US is being taken advantage of by North Korea and so on, and why so concerned about US mid-term elections?

Why is that, when I couildn't tell you a damned thing about Australian elections?

It seems, imho, that if you actually live in Australia, your in-depth knowledge of US foreign policy, the US military, and US politics, only makes sense if you are an ASIS troll.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:00 am

Tom Palven uses Holocaust Denier Propaganda
Tom Palven wrote: I don't give a leapin' lap dance who you invite, but why haven't you asked these (anti-holocaust denial) associates to jump in here before now?
They already have remember? Did you forget again? :lol: :lol:

You continuously spammed this hilarious holocaust denier propaganda on our forum, You then changed your claim knowing there were members of the UK Labor Party and Australian Labor Party here.
Tom Palven previously wrote: As leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party Adolph Hitler was an avowed socialist and also a warmonger.
Tom Palven modified his claim wrote:I'm not impressed. Hitler called himself a socialist, too, and was the leader of the Natiional Socialist Labor Party,
Historian Jeffk 1970 responded to your lies and propaganda
JeffK 1970] wrote: National Socialist German Workers' Party, damnit. Christ, if you are going to butcher history at least get the name right.
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=27757&p=657293&hilit=labor#p657293

You were then informed that Hitler closed down all unions, arrested socialists and sent them to Dachau Concentration camp before he started the holocaust against Jews. You were also informed that Hitler did not speak English, yet you faked quotes by Hitler in English.......... lifted from a holocaust denial video
Yogi bear 19.jpg
Senility is a real bummer for you Tom Palven. Try posting on Stormfront White Action Power forum.
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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:42 am

Tom Palven previously wrote: As leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party Adolph Hitler was an avowed socialist and also a warmonger.
Red triangle.jpg
Red triangle 2.jpg
Here are innocent socialists in their concentration camp uniforms with red triangles. Hitler and the Nazis put them there. Obviously, so would Tom Palven.

Why do you lie all the time Tom Palven?
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Yes, Matt Seems to be Trolling

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:25 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:42 am
Tom Palven previously wrote: As leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party Adolph Hitler was an avowed socialist and also a warmonger.
Dear Matt, you have maintained that since you call yourself a socialist, you cannot possibly be a warmonger, and I stated that Hitler was leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party who talked about the generous German welfare system in a speech I linked to, but was still a warmonger.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/nazi

Bernie Sanders is a member of the Democrat Party, and still calls himself a socialist, whereas you call yourself a socialist and are a warmonger, my point being, as you well know, that you can call yourself a socialist or a butterfly, but if you've never seen any US neoconservative imperialist warmongering that you don't endorse, you are a warmonger.

Whcih brings up another point, your insistence that there was no British Empire because England didn't have an emperor, which is really too ludicrous for me to bother to refute again.

Eric Hoffer said in The True Believer, 1951, "There is thus an illiterate air about the most literate true believer. He seems to use words as if he were ignorant of their true meaning. Hence, too, his taste for quibbling, hair-splitting, and scholastic tortuousness."

That's you in a nut shell, Matt, a true believer in US-British-Australian Anglo-Saxon hegemony, as you were apparently taught to love in your Aussie upbringing, and like a true-believing fundamentalist Christian you will twist and spin words and definitions in any way that you can in order to avoid confronting reality.

The reality is that the sun set on the British Empire and is rapidly setting on the US empire, and that ASIS and you are on the wrong side of history.

Even England is no longer totally in lockstep with US actions:
https://news.antiwar.com/2018/11/05/eu- ... sanctions/
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Austin Harper » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm

Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?
Dum ratio nos ducet, valebimus et multa bene geremus.

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by landrew » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:54 pm

Austin Harper wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm
Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?
Flame wars.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by OlegTheBatty » Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:12 pm

landrew wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:54 pm
Austin Harper wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm
Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?
Flame wars.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Matthew bases arguments on the difference in meaning between the dictionary and the vernacular. Tom is steeped in the vernacular, and doesn't fact check his sources.

All that's needed for a flame war to break out is posting their thoughts to each other.
. . . with the satisfied air of a man who thinks he has an idea of his own because he has commented on the idea of another . . . - Alexandre Dumas 'The Count of Monte Cristo"

There is no statement so absurd that it has not been uttered by some philosopher. - Cicero

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm

Austin Harper wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm
Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?

Do you think that Dick Cheney and John Bolton are warmongers? Was John "Bomb, bomb, bomb. Bomb bomb, Iran" McCain a warmonger?

Do you know the history of the US overthrowing the democratically-elected government of Iran and installing the brutal Shah?
https://historyplex.com/operation-ajax1 ... gnificance

Matt has apologized for proven liars, James Clapper and John Brennan, while wanting to kill or incarcerate the men who exposed their lies, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning.

If you'd actually critique his posts in addition to mine, you'd see that Matthew advocates the use of either US military action or provocative economic sanctions to solve any alleged problem in the world, be it in Afghanistan, Syria, Korea, or anywhere else, in exactly the same manner as other warmongering neoconservatives do.

See if you can find where in any of his 28,860 posts that he advocated peace and reconciliation anywhere.

You won't find anything.

Matthew advocates exactly the same things as Bolton does, while bashing the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity and Antiwar.com.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:42 pm

OlegTheBatty wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:12 pm
Matthew bases arguments on the difference in meaning between the dictionary and the vernacular. Tom is steeped in the vernacular, and doesn't fact check his sources.
I'm not sure what you mean, Oleg, but let me ask you, for example, do you agree with Matt's assertion that there was no British Empire because the Brits didn't have an emperor?

Imho this is the kind of "quibbling, hair-splitting, and scholastic tortuousness" that Eric Hoffer ascribed to The True Believer.

And if you think that his assertion is stupid, why not take him to task instead of just me?
Last edited by Tom Palven on Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by OlegTheBatty » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:44 pm

Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:42 pm
OlegTheBatty wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:12 pm


Matthew bases arguments on the difference in meaning between the dictionary and the vernacular. Tom is steeped in the vernacular, and doesn't fact check his sources.
I'm not sure what you mean, Oleg, but let me ask you, for example, do you agree with Matt's assertion that there was no Brtish Emipe becaue the Brits didn't have an emperor?

Imho this is the kind of "quibbling, hair-splitting, and scholastic tortuousness" that Eric Hoffer ascribed to The True Believer.

And if you think that his assertion is stupid, why not take him to task instead of just me?
Try looking up 'vernacular' in the dictionary.
. . . with the satisfied air of a man who thinks he has an idea of his own because he has commented on the idea of another . . . - Alexandre Dumas 'The Count of Monte Cristo"

There is no statement so absurd that it has not been uttered by some philosopher. - Cicero

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I Am Not Skeptical...

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:50 pm

OlegTheBatty wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:44 pm
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:42 pm
OlegTheBatty wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:12 pm


Matthew bases arguments on the difference in meaning between the dictionary and the vernacular. Tom is steeped in the vernacular, and doesn't fact check his sources.
...that Matt Ellard is Full of Crap.

I'm not sure what you mean, Oleg, but let me ask you, for example, do you agree with Matt's assertion that there was no Brtish Emipe because the Brits didn't have an emperor?

Imho this is the kind of "quibbling, hair-splitting, and scholastic tortuousness" that Eric Hoffer ascribed to The True Believer.

And if you think that his assertion is stupid, why not take him to task instead of just me?
Try looking up 'vernacular' in the dictionary.
...that Matt Ellard is Full of Crap.


Okay, I looked it up.

ver·nac·u·lar
[vərˈnakyələr]

NOUN
(the vernacular)
the language or dialect spoken by the ordinary people in a particular country or region.
"he wrote in the vernacular to reach a larger audience"
synonyms:
everyday language · spoken language · colloquial speech · [more]


And I looked up the dictionary definition of Empire that Matt would supposedly embrace, and it said this:

Definition of Empire in history
An empire is a political construct in which one state dominates over another state, or a series of states. At its heart, an empire is ruled by an emperor, even though many states in history without an emperor at their head are called "empires".

But that still doesn't tell me whether you think that Matt's assertion that there was no British empire was stupid, disingenuous, or spot-on.

Why not answer that?

Am I simply to assume that Matt is always right even though I know beyond all doubt and skepticism that he is full of crap?
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by OlegTheBatty » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:11 pm

Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:50 pm
was no British empire was stupid, disingenuous, or spot-on.

Why not answer that?
Because I am not arguing with either you or Matt. I responded to landrew's flame war comment and described the reason I think it is inevitable in a discussion between you and Matt.
. . . with the satisfied air of a man who thinks he has an idea of his own because he has commented on the idea of another . . . - Alexandre Dumas 'The Count of Monte Cristo"

There is no statement so absurd that it has not been uttered by some philosopher. - Cicero

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:27 pm

OlegTheBatty wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:11 pm
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:50 pm
was no British empire was stupid, disingenuous, or spot-on.

Why not answer that?
Because I am not arguing with either you or Matt. I responded to landrew's flame war comment and described the reason I think it is inevitable in a discussion between you and Matt.

But Oleg, but Oleg! don't you Hold these Truths to be Self-Evident that all People are Created Equal and that Matt Ellard is Full of Crap?
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by landrew » Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:31 pm

I just roll my eyes nowadays. The old Landrew might have criticized those engaging in a flame war.
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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:55 pm

Tom Palven wrote:Dear Matt, you have maintained that since you call yourself a socialist, you cannot possibly be a warmonger,
You are an idiot. I knew all the nuclear weapon reduction treaties such as START, SALTI SALTII and SALTIII, from the 1970s as I support peace. You never heard of any of them and I had to inform you.. Carl Sagan from the Skeptic's CFI help initiate the nuclear treaties with his work on nuclear winter. I joined the skeptics. :lol: :lol:

Tom Palven wrote: I stated that Hitler was leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party who talked about the generous German welfare system in a speech I linked to, but was still a warmonger.
You copied an holocaust deniers English translation from a video. Hitler never spoke English, never said he was a socialist in German in the video, and there was no German "welfare state" as Hitler banned trade unions and arrested socialists.

You made up a complete BS story that Hitler "avowed" he was a socialist and I pointed out you lies, with evidence on a skeptic forum.
:D :D

Tom Palven wrote: Whcih brings up another point, your insistence that there was no British Empire because England didn't have an emperor, which is really too ludicrous for me to bother to refute again.
You are lying again. You directly stated there was a current UK-USA Empire in Afghanistan today. Did you forget again?
Tom Palven previously wrote: You truly believe that the Anglo-american empire has been and still is.....
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=27640&p=667948&hil ... re#p667948

Why do you tell so many lies? :lol: :lol:

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:02 am

Austin Harper wrote: Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?
Tom watches Fox News and Fox news is claiming Hitler is a socialist and all socialists are warmongers. Therefore, following Fox News, Tom Palven claims, as I am a socialist I must be like Hitler.

Luckily, we already debunked this claim in the anti-holocaust denial subforum, five years ago, so I already knew Tom Palven was copying Fox News and holocaust denial websites.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Hitler, Nazis, Socialism, and Rightwing Propaganda / David Klein / January 2011
https://www.csun.edu/~vcmth00m/NazismSocialism.html
"For several years, the right wing has been equating nazism, the left, and socialism. This is standard propaganda for Fox News and the Tea Party which both denounce Obama as a socialist and at the same time portray him visually with a Hitler mustache."

Nazism is a right wing ideology. It is violently racist, anti-socialist, and it targets the political left for extermination. This is underscored by Albert Einstein's embrace of socialism throughout his life -- and in particular in his 1949 essay, Why Socialism? -- "


Tom thinks Albert Einstein is like Hitler. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:11 am

Tom Palven wrote:Matt has apologized for proven liars, James Clapper and John Brennan, while wanting to kill or incarcerate the men who exposed their lies, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning.
Where did I say I wanted to kill them? Link me to that post. :lol: :lol:

Snowden sent 750,000 secret documents to Russia and defected to Russia. He receives $US 200.000 a year in Moscow.

Assange is now cooperating with Mueller concerning the Russian take over of Wikileaks. He is about to leave the Ecuadorian Embassy in London after a recent court case where he tried to sue the ambassador and lost.

Chelsea Manning did the right thing and went to court. I have no problems with Chelsea Manning.

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:18 am

Tom Palven wrote:....do you agree with Matt's assertion that there was no British Empire because the Brits didn't have an emperor?
You are lying again. You claimed there was and still is a current UK-US Empire, which is insane.
Tom Palven previously wrote:You truly believe that the Anglo-american empire has been and still is.....
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=27640&p=667948&hil ... re#p667948

I then had to inform you that the British Empire ended with the handing back of India's independence and that George V was the last British emperor.
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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:25 am

Tom Palven wrote: See if you can find where in any of his 28,860 posts that he advocated peace and reconciliation anywhere. You won't find anything.
You forgot that you made this same claim three days ago and Austin linked to my pro-peace posts.
viewtopic.php?f=72&t=29793#p671567

Senility is a real bummer for you isn't it Tom Palven?
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Old Man Matthew...

Post by Tom Palven » Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:08 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:25 am
Tom Palven wrote: See if you can find where in any of his 28,860 posts that he advocated peace and reconciliation anywhere. You won't find anything.
You forgot that you made this same claim three days ago and Austin linked to my pro-peace posts.
viewtopic.php?f=72&t=29793#p671567




...He Just Keeps Trolling, Along.

Peace posts?

:lol:
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:22 am

Tom Palven wrote:...the Trump administration is failing to help the Deep State/MIC block reconciliation efforts between North and South Korea,
What is this magical Deep state you keep talking about Tom Palven? :lol: :lol:
hannity deep state 6.jpg

Trump kept the same sanctions on North Korea and North Korea kept making nuclear weapons. :lol: :lol:

North Korea has threatened to restart the development of its nuclear weapons program unless the United States lifts sanctions
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/as ... 32f8c35b50

Poor Poor Tom Palven. You just can't get anything right at all. :lol: :lol:
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But Old Man Ellard....

Post by Tom Palven » Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:48 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:11 am
Tom Palven wrote:Matt has apologized for proven liars, James Clapper and John Brennan, while wanting to kill or incarcerate the men who exposed their lies, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning.
Where did I say I wanted to kill them?


...That Old Man Ellard, He Just Keeps Trollin', along.

You said Assange should be executed as a spy, and the others imprisoned at best. Find the posts yourself. :mrgreen:
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Cadmusteeth » Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:44 pm

Been reading this thread and I know for a fact that didn't happen. There's nothing that even remotely insinuates that either.

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Austin Harper » Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:52 pm

Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm
Austin Harper wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm
Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?

Do you think that Dick Cheney and John Bolton are warmongers? Was John "Bomb, bomb, bomb. Bomb bomb, Iran" McCain a warmonger?
Yeah, I do thing they are warmongers. So does Matthew, and he doesn't support their views, as was shown in his post which you cited.
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm
Do you know the history of the US overthrowing the democratically-elected government of Iran and installing the brutal Shah?
https://historyplex.com/operation-ajax1 ... gnificance
Yeah, I do. What does that have to do with anything? Nobody here is suggesting that that was a good idea.
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm
Matt has apologized for proven liars, James Clapper and John Brennan, while wanting to kill or incarcerate the men who exposed their lies, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning.
No he didn't, but he just explained that to you between your post and this response so I'm not going to get into it more.
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm
If you'd actually critique his posts in addition to mine, you'd see that Matthew advocates the use of either US military action or provocative economic sanctions to solve any alleged problem in the world, be it in Afghanistan, Syria, Korea, or anywhere else, in exactly the same manner as other warmongering neoconservatives do.
No he doesn't, Tom. Where has he endorsed US military action?
Tom Palven wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:16 pm
See if you can find where in any of his 28,860 posts that he advocated peace and reconciliation anywhere.

You won't find anything.

Matthew advocates exactly the same things as Bolton does, while bashing the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity and Antiwar.com.
First of all, here's an example of him advocating peace:
Matthew Ellard wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:55 pm
I knew all the nuclear weapon reduction treaties such as START, SALTI SALTII and SALTIII, from the 1970s as I support peace.
Second, even if he hadn't advocated for peace, that's not the same thing as endorsing Bolton's views or advocating violence. I haven't seen you say that people shouldn't stick gum to the walls of the subway. Does that mean you think they should? Of course not.
Dum ratio nos ducet, valebimus et multa bene geremus.

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If You Knew Matthew, Like I Know Matthew..

Post by Tom Palven » Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:48 pm

Cadmusteeth wrote:
Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:44 pm
Been reading this thread and I know for a fact that didn't happen. There's nothing that even remotely insinuates that either.

...Oh, Oh, Oh What a Troll.

I'm not going to search my book review threads that Matt has trolled, but here is one little post from the A Monument to Courage is being planned thread:

Re: A Monument to Courage is Being Planned
Report
Quote

Post
by Matthew Ellard » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:50 pm
Tom Palven wrote:
You consider Assange,to be your enemies, yes or no?

Yes.


Also in my various threads Matt has insisted over and over that I post scripted Russian talking points, watch Sean Hannity, never graduated from college, and am a park ranger, among other things, none of which are remotely true.

You, Austin, Oleg, and others don't what the facts are, and I don't seem to be able to convince anyone of the truth, so I guess I'm just wasting my time refuting Matthew. Unlike you, he has checked out the facts and knows that he is spouting BS.

I had planned to continue to take the battle to him until he stopped posting that I'm an idiot, but I just may let it go, although I think there's another thing that I want to try to clarify.
Last edited by Tom Palven on Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:16 am

Austin Harper wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:50 pm
Why do you keep insisting that Matthew is a warmonger?
Because imho he is a warmongering ASIS control freak lackey.

But, anyway, this is one last thing I want to post from Matthew, and then I'll just get back to peace vs war issues and ignore his trolling:

Matthew Ellard wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:30 am
Tom Palven wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:18 am
As much as I deplore repetitiousness, Matt, it just seems that you have complete FAITH in the righteousness, purity, and benevolence of the US Empire and the British Empire before it,

No Tom Palven. You are a senile old retired park ranger, who spreads fake conspiracies, from Fox News, on a Skeptic forum that checks facts.

As you are a total idiot, you also forgot that empires have emperors.


Check the facts in Book Review/Discussion, the Killing Hope by William Blum thread, above.

There Matt is claiming that the British didn't have an Empire because empires have emperors, and I pointed out to him that Victoria claimed to be Empress of India.

But now, frankly, I'm done with old Matt. Fun in the beginning, and in a way it's been instructive, but it's just getting tedious and unrewarding.

One parting shot while I'm here, has anyone ever seen Matt and John Bolton in the same place at the same time?
https://news.antiwar.com/2018/11/05/bol ... re-coming/
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:40 am

Cadmusteeth wrote:Been reading this thread and I know for a fact that didn't happen. There's nothing that even remotely insinuates that either.
Tom Palven wrote:...Oh, Oh, Oh What a Troll. I'm not going to search my book review threads that Matt has trolled,:
Tom Palven claims I posted that I wanted to kill Assange, Manning and Snowden........but then says he refuses to back that up by looking to see if I actually did? This is why Tom Palven is a complete idiot. :D

/////////////////

Julian Assange takes payment from Russia / Russia takes over Wikileaks
Tom Palven wrote: You consider Assange,to be your enemies, yes or no?
Matthew Ellard wrote: Yes.
Soooooo......Tom has no problem with the Russians using Wikileaks to get Donald Trump in in 2016.
Tom Palven wrote: Matt has insisted over and over that I post scripted Russian talking points,
Yes Tom. Would you like to read your Russian talk points again about how "evil" James Clapper and John Brennan are, for saying Russia interfered in the 2016 election? Do you deny Russia interfered in the 2016 presidential election? :lol: :lol:

//////////////////

The direct lies of Tom Palven
Tom Palven wrote: You, Austin, Oleg, and others don't what the facts are,
Tom Palven wrote: The Fourth Reich Vichy Occupation Government of Afghanistan
Tom Palven wrote: Taliban threw out the Soviets
Tom Palven wrote: Hitler was an avowed socialist
Tom Palven wrote: There is a Deep State conspiracy
Tom Palven wrote: The Washington Warmonger Post (Tom hates liberals)
Tom Palven wrote: There is and still is a Anglo-US Empire
Tom Palven wrote: Chairman Mao got rid of the Chinese royal family
Tom Palven wrote: I studied Adam Smith for my economics modules
Tom Palven wrote: Adam Smith is not an economist

Tom Palven wrote: and I don't seem to be able to convince anyone ......
Yes. That's right. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:56 am

Tom Palven wrote:Because imho he is a warmongering ASIS control freak lackey.
Lucky then I am a tax lawyer and accountant in the entertainment industry, who joined the Australian Skeptics in the 90s. It presents me endless warfare opportunities :lol: :lol:

/////////////////////////////////
Tom Palven yesterday wrote: But, anyway, this is one last thing I want to post from Matthew, and then I'll just get back to peace vs war issues and ignore his trolling: Tom Palven wrote:
Tom Palven previously wrote: You truly believe that the Anglo-American empire has been and still is....
Matthew Ellard wrote:The USA and UK don't have a combined empire, nor do they have separate empires..
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=27640&p=667948&hil ... re#p667948

See what I did Tom Palven, I added a link so people can read your real quote. :lol: :lol: :lol:


////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Tom Palven wrote:I'm not going to search my book review threads
viewtopic.php?f=72&p=672294#p672276
Tom Palven wrote: Find the posts yourself
viewtopic.php?f=72&p=672294#p672111

Why are you so stupid and tell so many lies, Tom Palven? :lol: :lol:

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:21 am

Tom Palven yesterday wrote:(Matt) .... wanting to kill or incarcerate the men who exposed their lies, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning.
Matthew Ellard wrote: Where did I say I wanted to kill them?
Tom Palven today wrote:You said Assange should be executed as a spy, and the others imprisoned at best. Find the posts yourself.
Soooooo......here is what I actually posted Tom.........with links
Matthew Ellard, four days ago wrote:Assange already flipped a month ago about Russia controlling Wikileaks. That's how the USA indicted the Russians who hacked the documents that appeared on Wikileaks. However you missed the best bits of the deal...... " Assange has been ordered by the Ecuadorian government to steer clear of any and all political issues. In addition, Assange needs to keep the bathroom he uses at the embassy clean and take care of his cat, according to a memo on the Ecuadorean website Codigo Vidrio.
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=24767&start=280#p668346
Matthew Ellard, three days ago wrote:I'm more concerned for his cat, Michi, which lives at the embassy. I can imagine Assange's plea bargain somehow includes the cat. I'm sort of OK with that. If the British authorities promise to let a UK Assange fan take care of his cat, then Assange may be a bit more open in discussing Russian control of Wikileaks , with little cost to the UK DPP
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=24767&start=280#p668661

Tom Palven? Where do I say I am going to murder Julian Assange? :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:18 am

South Korea apologizes for 1980 brutality:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46123548
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by OutOfBreath » Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:28 am

Tom Palven wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:18 am
South Korea apologizes for 1980 brutality:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46123548
Indeed. Proving itself to be a true democracy, as only those ever apologize for excessive use of force in the past...
This was back in the South Korean military strongman days.

Peace
Dan
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Re: Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Fri Nov 09, 2018 4:36 am

Tom Palven wrote:...the Trump administration is failing to help the Deep State/MIC block reconciliation efforts between North and South Korea,
7th November 2018 / North Korea cancels Nuclear talks with Pompeo
https://www.wsj.com/articles/pompeos-me ... 1541569238

Tom Palven? Are you claiming North Korea and Jong Un are "the US Deep State" and blocking reconciliation efforts?

If not, who is this magical Deep State then?

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Fri Nov 09, 2018 6:32 am

Today's North Korea Times report is vague:
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/ ... 58420.html
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Austin Harper » Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:17 pm

This isn't meant as a criticism or endorsement of your argument but Korea Times is South Korean.
Or maybe you meant that it's the Korean Times' North Korean report?
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Re: A Peace Conspiracy

Post by Tom Palven » Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:38 pm

Austin Harper wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:17 pm
This isn't meant as a criticism or endorsement of your argument but Korea Times is South Korean.
Or maybe you meant that it's the Korean Times' North Korean report?

My bad, but not intentionally misleading, and akin, imho, to what Oleg said, that "Tom ...doesn't fact check his sources."

In my further defense, I don't think that any of my "lies" as Matt calls them, have been attempts to mislead. When I have said something like "lying John Brennan and James Clapper are Matt's heroes, and he wants to kill or incarcerate Edward Snowden, Julian Assange, and Chelsea Manning," it's just to point out the reality of that's the way he feels, although he may never have used the word "hero" or "kill," he has consistently apologized for the actions of Brennan, Clapper, and other neoconservatives while advocating the arrest and conviction as traitors those men who exposed their blatant lies to the US Congress. As such, I am just expressing my humble OPINION, not constructing a legal brief.

It may be Matt's opinion that I am an idiot, and that's fine, but on the other hand, knows full well that he is attempting to mislead when he makes assertions about my education, employment, etc. that he has already fact-checked and knows are lies.

I'll offer my opinion one last time that half of what Matt says is rubbish and the other half is bullcrap, and now I'll try to avoid discussing him further.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot 2

Post by Matthew Ellard » Sat Nov 10, 2018 2:28 am

Tom Palven yesterday wrote: I stand by "Vichy Fourth Reich puppet government of Afghanistan" as an accurate description
Tom Palven today wrote: I don't think that any of my "lies" as Matt calls them, have been attempts to mislead.
1) The Third Reich was in Germany, there is no Fourth Reich
2) Vichy is a city in France and was not occupied by the Germans
3) The Afghan government is democratically elected by 45% of the citizens and not a NATO occupation government.

You simply lie all the time. Why is that?
:lol: :lol:
Tom Palven previously wrote: I had to study Adam Smith for my economic modules
Tom Palven today wrote:....he makes assertions about my education, employment, etc. that he has already fact-checked and knows are lies.
You studied horticulture you idiot and worked as a horticulturist. You never studied economics. You never read Adam Smith's economic theory including the "invisible hand ".

You are just a compulsive liar.
:lol: :lol:

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Don't Bother, Just Matt's BS

Post by Tom Palven » Sun Nov 11, 2018 2:48 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Sat Nov 10, 2018 2:28 am

Tom Palven wrote
"I had to study Adam Smith for my economic modules"
I wish I were truly done with you, but I have to refute this. Smith was only briefly mentioned in a macroeconomics course I took at Cornell, and I read both his A Theory of Moral Sentiments and An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations on my own, however I've never even heard the term "economic modules."

Just more of you usual horsecrap.

https://news.antiwar.com/2018/11/10/us- ... yemen-war/
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Tom Palven is an idiot

Post by Matthew Ellard » Sun Nov 11, 2018 10:56 pm

Tom Palven, the horticulturist wrote: I wish I were truly done with you, but I have to refute this. Smith was only briefly mentioned in a macroeconomics course I took at Cornell, and I read both his A Theory of Moral Sentiments and An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations on my own
Tom Palven, previously wrote:Although it was not required reading in my economics courses at Cornell (The Wealth of Nations was) I had taken it out of the library and perused it, and I thought I had found it to be more useful than I find it now.
Tom Palven, previously wrote: Adam Smith was not an economist
You didn't study economics Tom Palven. You studied horticulture and you haven't got a clue what Adam Smith wrote.
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