Lame Explanations for UFOs

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Bart Stewart
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Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Bart Stewart » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:21 pm

I agree there is no good evidence for extraterrestrial visitation of the earth, but shaky and/or lame explanations for UFOs don't help the skeptical case. My favorite example of this goes all the way back to a book I had as a child.

I think it was called The Big Book of Answers. Something like that. It was a kids' book with answers to various questions. On the subject of UFOs, it said ice sheets in the atmosphere can reflect lights from the ground like a mirror.

This remains the one and only time I have ever heard that explanation for the UFO phenomenon! (And it made it all the way into The Big Book of Answers!)

Atmospheric inversion is a real thing, and it accounts for "spook lights" like the Marfa lights and the Fata Morgana. Here are some nice photos of the Fata Morgana --

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch& ... 1&dpr=1.33

Not familiar with mirror-like ice sheets in the sky.

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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:32 pm

It's ice fog in the atmosphere. Not "ice sheets".
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:12 pm

fog: Droplets of water vapor suspended in the air near the ground, ergo:

Ice crystals in the atmosphere.
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:57 pm

bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:fog: Droplets of water vapor suspended in the air near the ground, ergo:

Ice crystals in the atmosphere.

Depending on the inversion layers you can get clouds of ice crystals several thousand feet in the air.
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby ElectricMonk » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:26 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:fog: Droplets of water vapor suspended in the air near the ground, ergo:

Ice crystals in the atmosphere.

Depending on the inversion layers you can get clouds of ice crystals several thousand feet in the air.


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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Bart Stewart » Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:38 am

Would ice fog create a mirror effect?

I have never heard anyone offer atmospheric ice fog as an explanation for UFOs any more than ice sheets.

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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Matthew Ellard » Fri Dec 08, 2017 3:42 am

Bart Stewart wrote:Would ice fog create a mirror effect? .
I didn't see any direct confirmation but ice does cause atmospheric optical effects.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_optics
http://www.severewx.com/Radiation/reflection.html

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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:41 pm

Bart Stewart wrote:Would ice fog create a mirror effect?

I have never heard anyone offer atmospheric ice fog as an explanation for UFOs any more than ice sheets.

Given the flukey nature of the atmosphere and the very, very weak evidence given by the "observer" it would be at least a possible explanation.
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby OlegTheBatty » Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:02 pm

Bart Stewart wrote:Would ice fog create a mirror effect?

I have never heard anyone offer atmospheric ice fog as an explanation for UFOs any more than ice sheets.


Reflections and refractions.

Refractions would be more likely to be mistaken for objects because they usually have an appreciable angle of separation from the source. Reflections bright enough generally are closer to being in line of sight to the source. Of course, reflections from non-atmospheric sources could be anywhere.

Sun dogs are caused by refraction from ice crystals.
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:28 pm

When I hear "Ice Crystals" I always first think of carburetor heat, then I remember I flew jets where that wasn't an issue. There is lots of ice in the atmosphere..........as opposed to it being rare. Hmmmmm.........I'm making this up: but given where rain forms and the ambient air temps........seems to me most "rain" is melted ice. Ice that stays suspended in clouds is the normal thought. Very thin but still layers and presence of ice at high altitude are a given. What else would happen at Minus 55 Degrees?

EDIT: It does crack me up. EVERY video I have ever seen about rain formation shows water vapor accreting around some particle of dust until it gets too big and then it falls. I wondered then....always "dust" or can, or even must, water vapor accrete to itself as well, and then....what % of the atmosphere is at freezing or below?
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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby Lance Kennedy » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:07 pm

Here is an experiment for you, Bobbo. Load a plane with finely ground ice, and fly above a black cloud, spraying ice dust into it, and see if it all turns to rain.

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Re: Lame Explanations for UFOs

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:18 pm

It would depend on the air temp. I thought that was clear? A black cloud worth the mention goes above 40K feet and higher....above commercial airline abilities..............but I'd be willing to try...............
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