Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by scrmbldggs » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:32 pm

Have your doc check and, perhaps, change your meds. And don't forget to wear your helmet, dear.
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:35 pm

gorgeous wrote:Seth might be one......
Seth is a fictional character from a book by Jane Roberts.
gorgeous wrote:generally an evolved guide is one who has great understanding of life on Earth
Not one of Seth's "predictions" ever happened. :lol:

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:41 am

gorgeous wrote:soo....^^^ scientists are proving obe's are real......haaaa
OBEs are real the same way dreams are real. These are psychological phenomena that have nothing to do with objective, scientifically verifieble reality, that is separate from our psychology. What occurs during OBEs is as much useful as what occurs during one's dream. Some people may claim that dreams help them process things - sweet, whatever tickle... but they are not objectively real, they are not the same as me, for example, thinking to have 50,000 buks in my account, going shopping and finding out the hard way that is not exactly true... or, a person waking up in a hospital with permanent spinal injury following an accident regardless if they want to accept or not... or getting assaulted while being asleep or drugged..or a scientist in a lab really wanting to find a cure for cancer but not succeeding. These are examples of reality that is external to one's psychology.

I guess for you G, a person who believes that everything is a spiritual synchronicity something like a dream would feel real, as you dwell on meaning of these things, for most people it's just a dream, making no effect on their objective reality, most people do not even remember dreams as they are so meaningless to their lives. Most people prefer to focus on practical stuff.

Do you know why people stick to their spiritual beliefs and religions? Because they want to feel special, they want to believe that they are an important aspect of the universe, that there is a purpose for them. Unfortunately, that also leads to great level of ignorance and arrogance of such people towards the actual reality where things occur randomly, are not based on merit and for the most part are meaningless. When religious/spiritual people drop their illusions they tend to become more liberated and accepting of others as equal to themselves, but for that to occur they need to first be prepared to lose all the credit they have been giving themselves for pure luck and privileges. This is exactly why they have so much invested in maintaining religious believes and defend them so desperately. It's like telling a child for a first time that the Santa did not bring their gifts. I have news for you G, the Santa does not even know you exist, the guy is long dead and could not care less! :-D

You may find this useful. One of the people who runs this project (Jessica Schab) used to be an 'Indigo Child' now she is telling the world the truth. http://eofproject.org/biases

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:21 pm

people are spiritual because they know and feel....obe's are real ...many dreams are of obe's..-------. seth----"There is one self and it focuses its attention in various dimensions. In the waking state it focuses in physical reality. In the dream state it is focused within a different dimension.

This does not mean that we do not sometimes leave our bodies and travel in our dream to other physical locations. ------
In our dream life we also visit other levels of existence, and gain needed skills"
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:34 pm

gorgeous wrote:people are spiritual because they know and feel....obe's are real ...many dreams are of obe's..-------. seth----"There is one self and it focuses its attention in various dimensions. In the waking state it focuses in physical reality. In the dream state it is focused within a different dimension.

This does not mean that we do not sometimes leave our bodies and travel in our dream to other physical locations. ------
In our dream life we also visit other levels of existence, and gain needed skills"
Gorgeous, do you remember your dreams? I sometimes do, and I can tell you they are nothing else but scraps of daily activities and thoughts. Sometimes I just dream of cleaning pots if that is a the last activity I completed in the day, other times I dream of a movie I just watched. Dreams are a 'rubbish bin' for neuronal firing that gets somewhat confused and jumbled with other memories.

One of the common dreams people experience and report is finding themselves back at high school about to sit exams and feeling not prepared...another one is finding oneself naked in a crowd - these are the reasons why psychoanalytics like Jung or Freud believed that dreams are a representation of unprocessed traumas, for instance finding oneself naked in a crowd represents a significant shame one carries. There is nothing magical about dreams, they are a representation of the psych processes.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:00 pm

no evidence...dreams are also real experiences...people are active out of body when they sleep..-------seth------In your sleep you do indeed travel, again, those vast distances between
birth and death. Your consciousness as you think of it transcends these
leaps and holds its own sense of continuity. All of this has to do with pulsations
of energy and consciousness, and in one way what you think of
as your life is the apparent "length" of a light ray seen from another perspective.
(10:00.) Beneath the dreams that you recall are experiences of consciousness
that appear only now and then, and in distorted form. These
express in nonphysical terms your relationship with your own being.-------"Within the dream state all mankind knows the outcome of any given dilemma. No predestination is involved. The problems have already been worked out in a mental or psychic level, but not yet physically materialized. Precognitive dreams therefore are precognitive only in line with your own accepted root assumptions. Decisions have already been made, but have not yet caught up to you within the physical system."

-------------------"Now there are classes indeed where the newly dead are instructed. I used to teach some of these."
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Nikki Nyx » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:01 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
gorgeous wrote:not elites...the evolved guides spend their time to guide and help others make good choices and gain understanding...
Nikki Nyx wrote: I'm probably going to kick myself for asking, but dafuq is an "evolved guide?"
Gorgeous is referring to "Seth", the 60's channelled spirit guide, that appears in books, by Jane Roberts.
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"An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof."—Marcello Truzzi

"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence."—Christopher Hitchens

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Nikki Nyx » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:06 pm

gorgeous wrote:Seth might be one......generally an evolved guide is one who has great understanding of life on Earth and also the non-physical dimensions.....how they get that job...idk......people out of body have had encounters with these extremely wise ,knowledgeable souls...being in their midst can very intimidating and make one feel very small in comparison...
Er...what language are you speaking? It sounds like BS.
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"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence."—Christopher Hitchens

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:08 pm

read and watch videos about obe's ...you will learn about the greater reality...
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:33 pm

gorgeous wrote:no evidence...dreams are also real experiences...people are active out of body when they sleep..-------seth------In your sleep you do indeed travel, again, those vast distances between
birth and death. Your consciousness as you think of it transcends these
leaps and holds its own sense of continuity. All of this has to do with pulsations
of energy and consciousness, and in one way what you think of
as your life is the apparent "length" of a light ray seen from another perspective.
(10:00.) Beneath the dreams that you recall are experiences of consciousness
that appear only now and then, and in distorted form. These
express in nonphysical terms your relationship with your own being.-------"Within the dream state all mankind knows the outcome of any given dilemma. No predestination is involved. The problems have already been worked out in a mental or psychic level, but not yet physically materialized. Precognitive dreams therefore are precognitive only in line with your own accepted root assumptions. Decisions have already been made, but have not yet caught up to you within the physical system."

-------------------"Now there are classes indeed where the newly dead are instructed. I used to teach some of these."
Actually G, that is all, in a Wikipedia’s simplicity, that we know of dreaming today https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oneirology Yes to suppressed emotions, yes to similarity to the delusions of those suffering mental illness, and yes to dreams as a function of the memory systems. No to magic, no to precognition and no to objective/real experiences. Sorry hun. ;-)

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:58 pm

nonsense...show me a dream...
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:59 pm

During REM sleep, researchers-------- theorize ----------------that the brain goes through .....theory
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:34 pm

LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic. You do that often, don’t you? I insure you G those scientists have put more effort and consultation into understanding, objectively reality than your Seth did. I wonder how much have you done for Seth and how much have Seth done for you... There are support groups for cult victims, just saying, better late than ever, you would still get some of your remaining life to experience things by independent thought based on reality and find happiness in it. You would not be spending your life on skeptic’s forums paranoid that one of those people may in fact say something that will open your eyes - do you know Georgous that the fact you are even here so persistently (as obviously you are not a skeptic, you don’t have to be here at all, you can join forums where people think like you, you are free to do that) is your own subconscious directing you here, you want out of Seth’s cult, you are just stuck and scared. Nothing to be scared of, nobody knows who you are, you can just one day decide to change your mind and walk away from Seth. It’s your and only your life.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by scrmbldggs » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:34 pm

Mara wrote:LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic...
It does that often. To keep the feeding going...
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:16 pm

Mara wrote:LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic.
I laugh most when Gorgeous says we don't exist while we are posting, and then simultaneously claims "Seth" the channelled spirit exists.

Gorgeous will also simultaneously claim the Illuminati and then alien reptile humanoids, and then god, rules the world.

Gorgeous is just damaged goods, copying what ever he last read, on a "woo" forum, here, to get attention.
:D

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:06 pm

seth is living the other dimensions now.........he knows......still just a theory...aka guess...
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:08 pm

gorgeous wrote:seth is living the other dimensions now.........he knows......still just a theory...aka guess...
That's just funny. Jane Roberts died of alcoholism and that was the end of her "Seth" character in her books.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:12 pm

yes, but seth being a spirit like Jane ---they both live on in the non-physical...
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by OlegTheBatty » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:19 pm

gorgeous wrote:yes, but seth being a spirit like Jane ---they both live on in the non-physical imagination of the gullibulati...
FIFY.

No, no, a reward is not necessary. I was glad to donate the time.
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:19 pm

gorgeous wrote:yes, but seth being a spirit like Jane --..
Nope. Seth was a fictional character in her books.

That's why none of Seth's predictions ever came true. Didn't you know?

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:38 am

scrmbldggs wrote:
Mara wrote:LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic...
It does that often. To keep the feeding going...
It’s actually something we should feel concerned about rather than irritated with. Watching a fellow human wasting life time stuck in one framework. Trying and exploring things is OK but eventually a person needs to move onto other things, especially in the absence of evidence. Even if evidence is not the concern for some as let’s face it some individuals are more philosophically inclined, still there are hundreds of cultures, religions and lenses to explore.

The Seth channeling is very similar to the Monroe explorer program and the kind of stuff people in regressive hypnosis come across. A subject reaches certain level of focus (or trance) and accesses the unlimited parts of the self that come across in a different speech form (that’s why the multiple sub-personality theory is so fascinating!). We all have more potential but are teamed by society. Athletes for instance are people who with a sufficient level of quidance, isolation and work into personal development can reach new levels that others believe are not possible, even after serious injury, however that is not supernatural or spiritual, it’s simply more than an average Jo Blow knows about themselves. I just don’t see how spending entire live defending someone elses’s theory is helping G reach higher levels...it’s a prison.

For most of us here the theory does not affect the personal lives. We have very little to lose if materialism is the starting point, it can only get ‘brighter’ shall the mainstream be found to be wrong. My knowledge of psych is something I use daily to build myself up, these are tools available to ourselves, we are a product of incredible evolution.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:40 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Mara wrote:LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic.
I laugh most when Gorgeous says we don't exist while we are posting, and then simultaneously claims "Seth" the channelled spirit exists.

Gorgeous will also simultaneously claim the Illuminati and then alien reptile humanoids, and then god, rules the world.

Gorgeous is just damaged goods, copying what ever he last read, on a "woo" forum, here, to get attention.
:D
Apologies if I don’t respond to many of you. I really just get some of the notifications. I did not get one for this, just noticed it now by scrolling up.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:52 am

Mara wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:
Mara wrote:LOL you just did a 360 degree circle in your logic...
It does that often. To keep the feeding going...
It’s actually something we should feel concerned about rather than irritated with. Watching a fellow human wasting life time stuck in one framework. Trying and exploring things is OK but eventually a person needs to move onto other things, especially in the absence of evidence. Even if evidence is not the concern for some as let’s face it some individuals are more philosophically inclined, still there are hundreds of cultures, religions and lenses to explore.

The Seth channeling is very similar to the Monroe explorer program and the kind of stuff people in regressive hypnosis come across. A subject reaches certain level of focus (or trance) and accesses the unlimited parts of the self that come across in a different speech form (that’s why the multiple sub-personality theory is so fascinating!). We all have more potential but are teamed by society. Athletes for instance are people who with a sufficient level of quidance, isolation and work into personal development can reach new levels that others believe are not possible, even after serious injury, however that is not supernatural or spiritual, it’s simply more than an average Jo Blow knows about themselves. I just don’t see how spending entire live defending someone elses’s theory is helping G reach higher levels...it’s a prison.

For most of us here the theory does not affect the personal lives. We have very little to lose if materialism is the starting point, it can only get ‘brighter’ shall the mainstream be found to be wrong. My knowledge of psych is something I use daily to build myself up, these are tools available to ourselves, we are a product of incredible evolution.
Considering the other stuff this troll is into (conspiracy theories, false flags and crisis actors, and spreading vile rumors about victims of tragedies and the like), I strongly doubt georgie firmly holds to such beliefs as he/she/it keeps spamming this board with. It only comes here for attention - no matter what form that takes, and we already tried to have him seek help for his apparent strange need.

But I'm in no way trying to tell you what to do. However, you might find your kind effort and extended time and energy simply go down some black hole...
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:05 am

scrmbldggs wrote: But I'm in no way trying to tell you what to do. However, you might find your kind effort and extended time and energy simply go down some black hole...
Sure.

...you get through one ray at the time and one day they may see the sun.

For me the concern is that this is happening to more and more people. At some point the governments will need to recognise that it is a problem as it’s leading to regress not progress of society. Most of the New Age is just words, empty feel good rhetoric that steals time...lots of time, as people become so absorbed by it.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:08 am

I also wanted to say that neuroplasticity and epigenetics are occurring and if large amounts of people get stuck in such intellectual limbo this will have long term implications.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:30 am

You don't say. That could affect such things as, let's say, elections?!

(What's kinda funny is that I had just left this elsewhere, but I think it fits here nicely also. Maybe it's some kind of NLP? :-P)
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:32 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
gorgeous wrote:seth is living the other dimensions now.........he knows......still just a theory...aka guess...
That's just funny. Jane Roberts died of alcoholism and that was the end of her "Seth" character in her books.
She probably drunk for a reason, people forgot that this was a generation of humans that experienced the direct effects of war, she had trauma. Seth was what she needed to make it as far as she did.

You know, even severe schizophrenics often know deep down that they are not well. I experienced that few times with clients where a person in the middle of psychosis presented themselves to the service seeking help saying the voices are telling them to hurt their mother and siblings, please help. That’s why I believe there is hope. Jane knew she was not 100% that’s why she was compliant with the medication against Seth’s advise, even one of the well known OBE explorers William Buhlman went with chemotherapy while suffering cancer. The voice of survival and decency is often louder than any delusions. I think it’s unfortunate that people like Jane, Nicolls, Buhlman, Campbell etc. go public and make career out of something that really is just a stage of their lives were they were processing stuff. Once you go public there is no way back.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:34 am

scrmbldggs wrote:You don't say. That could affect such things as, let's say, elections?!

(What's kinda funny is that I had just left this elsewhere, but I think it fits here nicely also. Maybe it's some kind of NLP? :-P)
Elections, education system, our future brain structures and genetic make up! I am so glad I never had children, I’d be sh*t worried.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:38 am

But one would think that someone as aware as you would make a good parent. Or teacher. ;)
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:48 am

scrmbldggs wrote:But one would think that someone as aware as you would make a good parent. Or teacher. ;)
Thx. I don’t like the idea of using my children to change the world.

Whoever came up with the idea for the film Idiocracy was highly intelligent. Populist politics is one step towards it.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:18 am

Mara wrote: Jane knew she was not 100% that’s why she was compliant with the medication against Seth’s advise,
Either you did some research or you know your 60's and 70's cults. We had some original early 70's followers of Jane Roberts come to this forum to "fight for her honour" and they were still in denial about Jane's alcoholism. One was Barrie who is in this photo.
Barrie and Jane.JPG
They were both putting out poetry books inspired by Seth, for profit.[/color]
https://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic. ... 00#p520464
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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:32 am

I did research. Who knows what was happening there. Maybe even her husband was drugging her with something to get profit of her vulnerability. You wouldn’t believe the kind of cases I got exposure to when working with a domestic and family violence service. Most people do not realise how far some will go. Narcissism is a real condition.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:12 am

Mara wrote:I did research.
Good on you. Not many people read about the early post war cults anymore.

Of interest, both Jane Roberts and Ron L Hubbard were hack writers for science fiction magazines of the 50's. I think they consciously started their cults for profit and didn't believe a word of what they said.

We had another cult follower here called Freebill who promoted the channelled alien "Ra" AKA "The Law of One". I delved into that and discovered the cult leaders, Carla Rueckert and Don Elkins had made a soft core porn science fiction film, "Invasion of the Girl Snatchers" before starting the cult.
:D

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:40 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Mara wrote:I did research.
Good on you. Not many people read about the early post war cults anymore.

Of interest, both Jane Roberts and Ron L Hubbard were hack writers for science fiction magazines of the 50's. I think they consciously started their cults for profit and didn't believe a word of what they said.

We had another cult follower here called Freebill who promoted the channelled alien "Ra" AKA "The Law of One". I delved into that and discovered the cult leaders, Carla Rueckert and Don Elkins had made a soft core porn science fiction film, "Invasion of the Girl Snatchers" before starting the cult.
:D
I have a day off so what the hell, I will do this…I have always been fascinated with this kind of research as I think at some point psychiatry will need to look into it and properly define it. I should add that the current definition of mental illness is very vague, symptoms based and focuses on cases where the person's mental functioning has adverse effects on every day life such as an ability to sleep, maintain a job or relationships i.e. is very general and many cases of mentally ill people are never diagnosed, they just make it through, they may be perceived as eccentric or a bit odd but can survive in the world in general.

It actually may be that Jane was not under any influence. Let me explain the reasons why I am such a proponent of the psychoanalysis/psychotherapy, subpersonalities theory and gestalt psychology (how we make meaning out of the chaotic world) that have been swept under the carpet by modern psychology in favour of cognitive behavioural therapy (for economic reasons mostly).

The basis for understanding of subpersonality theories
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subpersonality

Subpersonalities in Psychotherapy
For a somewhat different viewpoint: Many schools of psychotherapy see subpersonalities as relatively enduring psychological structures or entities that influence how a person feels, perceives, behaves, and sees him- or herself. Over the history of psychotherapy, many forms of therapy have worked with inner diversity representations or subpersonalities.[4][5] Early methods were Jungian analysis, Psychosynthesis, Transactional analysis, and Gestalt therapy. These were followed by some forms of hypnotherapy and the inner child work of John Bradshaw and others. Eventually, forms of therapy largely based on working with subpersonalities have arisen - Voice Dialogue, Ego-state therapy, and John Rowan's work in Transpersonal psychology.[6] The most recent and widespread subpersonality method is Internal Family Systems Therapy, developed by Richard C. Schwartz. He sees DID alters as on the same continuum as IFS parts (subpersonalities), the only difference being that alters are more polarized and split off from the rest of the internal system. Recent studies have shown that subpersonality integration in the psychosynthesis therapeutic setting can help clients relieve anxiety and rebuild their identities when dealing with culture shock,[7] enhance creativity,[8] and help to awaken personal and spiritual growth in self-identified atheists.[9]



If you listen to Jane's 'trance' recordings such as this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMRYkgBjCoA

and then, listen to #5, #6, #13 and #14 of the recordings of the Explorer series that Monroe posted for people to make up their minds about their findings from https://www.monroeinstitute.org/explorer-series
(any other recordings from there would work as well, but these 4 belong to the same individual and are of good audio quality in comparison to some of the other ones).

and then, listen to this hypnotic session by Mary Rodwell that illustrates a similar 'unusual' channelling case https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pOsSqil0Lo

The things that I observe:

- the participants access another 'self' within themselves, they differentiate this other identity by switching tone of their voice and putting on a different accent, and perhaps even traits as that's what sub-personality theory suggests (I am actually suggesting they are doing this unconsciously).

- the participants, seem to have significant New Age, spirituality based knowledge and beliefs. In Jane's case she was religious to some extent and obviously very creative.

- the participants seem to lose themselves when in this state of deep trance and give those other selves priority of communication with the external world.

This is similar to having a REM stage dream when the cognitive functioning is not 100% and the dreamer is 'making sense' out of whatever goes through their mind. Also, similar occurs when people are high on drugs, it feels like the absolute truth at the time, the next day…not so much (I have experimented so I can comment ;p)

- the other self, in each case seems to be more confident and knowledgeable than the primary self when not in a state of deep trance, yet in all cases the other self is not able to offer ANY TANGIBLE KNOWLEDGE greater than what the actual person (the primary self) is capable of understanding at the given time.

Let's take MIRANON's story (I'll spare you listening to it)

Miranon claims to be a spiritual entity that is not the actual person (the actual person has been given an identification code by Monroe of 'SHE'). When SHE goes into a deep focus level/trance, she claims to step aside and Miranon steps in, to communicate apparently the incredible advanced knowledge from other realms that she has. Based on 4 hours of jumbling on about random meaningless stuff that is derived from New Age theories that one can find in any New Age literature, Bob Monroe finally pushes her with a gentle but direct question and that is what happens:

(this is Explorer Series #13 Miranon: Human Existence starting at 43 minutes and 28 seconds)

Rob: …one of the things in reviewing… that we did not yet get, that we are much interested in are the mathematical formulas for these 'seven levels' that in our earlier meetings you indicated that these were available to us and I wonder if you had these?

Miranon: I have given you these formulas [she did not, I listened to all recordings and even emailed Monroe Institute(MI), they gave me a picture of 7 levels that a 4 year old could draw, I don't have it anymore but if you guys are interested you can email MI, they give it out for free], I must explain to you several of the difficulties…on the level that I am on thought is of a different form than the kind of thought which you are operating with. It is…[here she is clearly buying time]…again, difficult to put it into words…[mind you she did not experience those difficulties with human language in regards to any other self-indulging subjective jumbling]….Your brain…that with which you think that you think is more like an eye, it is like a computer, it has the ability to organise and materialise concepts… when you are on the spiritual level planes it is different, the thought forms are not computerised, they are visualised and pattern-nised [had no idea that is an actual word]

Rob: I understand your difficulties with it…

Miranon: If you need the formulas [and here comes the punchline guys!] I CAN TRY TO GET THEM FOR YOU but I also know they are available to you.

Rob: I did not …aaa… realised that we have received the formulas… in the form that we could perceive… if they are available to us again…I would like to then try to take visual notes at the time…

Miranon: I do not understand what you are saying [Classic! You could not make this sh*t up]

Rob: aaa, if they..ah…you have given these to us then?

Miranon: Yes, I have.

Rob: I have ...in reviewing, I did not find them and evidently we lost our recording of them or my notes on them [nice try Rob!] …and this is why I was…I do not seem to have a memory of how we got them…

Miranon: I am certain that you have had them, but I WILL BRING THEM TO YOU AGAIN [why not just give them now…?]

Rob: Very good, I appreciate it.

Miranon: There is one other thing... [and here she changes topic conveniently]


There are other situations like this one during the course of the conversations across all recordings where Miranon manoeuvres from answering other questions by saying that she must go because the vibrational state is not good for her…or because SHE has to rest etc. Miranon actually does not answer one single concrete question and whenever starts to feel 'cornered' by Rob finds excuses. It's like a child making up lies on the go. We all have a child like that in ourselves and when that child is given a tool of adult langauge it starts to sound convincing (to some) as if it was an actual entity yet with an ego of a child. This is an important concept to understand about human perception. There is also such concept in psychology as mirror psychology and it might be that those entities/other selves are a collection of those observed traits from our environment that we get exposure to through lives that would explain the tone of voice or accents. Some people who are not well integrated when faced with incidents in life that are new to them tend to respond to them as somebody else they would know, their brains basically scan the memory for the most appropriate action that they have seen somewhere else. We are conditioned beings to a large extent.

Similarly, when we listen to Mary Rodwell's regression hypnotherapy (our national pride Matt! :-() session when Mary asks Peter's 'alien friend' (the other self that took over) specific questions, he simply says 'Ehm, Peter knows'. Seriously people, how stupid those apparently professionals, are?

There is also a doco that Mary Rodwell did on 'Star Children' http://thestarchildren.net/alien-docume ... abilities/
Right in the first few minutes at 16:13 the woman in the video Rochelle who claims to be an ET healer shows a sign of dissociation, her voice changes into a more innocent person, almost like when dealing with inner child. This is observable in therapy amongst victims of sexual abuse for instance. In that doco there is a guy called Adrian who claims to see two dimensions in one of which there is an alien hospital that got built in his office, with that perception he becomes a healer as his second job to engineering. The guy actually comes across like an educated intelligent dude who put his reputation at great risk coming forward with this. It is worth pointing out that he passed away in his 40ties I believe from severe attack of mono that somehow his green friends did not help him with...

The deep trance recordings and videos are hours of empty self-indulging rhetoric of selves that play around with knowledge the primary self already has. These other selves seem to be full of excuses, convenient reasoning, lacking any self-reflection and have manipulative tendencies. These really shows us something about fundamental human nature and hints about some of the human behaviours particularly if they are unbalanced due to traumatic events or just brain chemistry issues. It is actually a scary realisation for humanity if this exists so widely, we need to develop interventions where people can integrate their selves. People like Jane and Rochelle actually committed their lives into following those subjective experiences as if they were real. This is not just a person with occasional creativity...This phenomena call for recognition as a problem. I often wonder what happened to the participants of the MI research… There are studies today regarding regression hypnotherapy that show how false memories can be implanted in those stages of deep trance/hypnosis. If this is true somebody like Rodwell could be facing compensation liability for screwing a lot of people, but I am more worried about the state of the society.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:27 am

Watching a fellow human wasting life time stuck in one framework. ------ditto
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:32 am

gorgeous wrote:Watching a fellow human wasting life time stuck in one framework. ------ditto
I wouldn't call it a framework... you are stuck in one specific New Age cult suitable for individuals with a cognitive capability and articulation of a 10 year old. Indeed, very sad.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:33 am

fyi...the govt has trained people in remote viewing and obe's at the Monroe Institute and NSA....
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:34 am

ignorant pompous babbling by science fanatics as usual...
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by Mara » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:45 am

gorgeous wrote:ignorant pompous babbling by science fanatics as usual...
ahh... Gorgeous, anger usually shows through when a person subconsciously knows the have been burnt...It's a protective behaviour of a hurt ego.

...If you at least had a decent foundational knowledge we could have a meaningful conversation about agreeing to disagree but you really have nothing else but Seth's cult and overly generalised phrases that you throw around basically mindlessly like 'nothing exists' - You may as well go around and say 'banana, banana' as it would have the same practical value. It's a shame really, but it's not too late G. You can still get some proper knowledge and then come back here and argue with us.

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Re: Graham Nicholls OBE a skeptical look

Post by gorgeous » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:46 am

ignorant pompous babbling by science fanatics as usual
Science Fundamentalism...is exactly what happens when there’s a significant, perceived ideological threat to one’s traditions and identity.