Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Gord » Mon Nov 02, 2015 12:50 am

Lance Kennedy wrote:The population of Finland is a little over 5 million. If we assume an added 1% is not too great a burden on their unconditional basic income system, that is over 50,000 refugees.

Would that be per year? Per generation?
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Lance Kennedy » Mon Nov 02, 2015 6:16 pm

How can I answer that?

But, for argument sake, call it per decade.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Mon Nov 02, 2015 6:20 pm

Heard it on the news that some country was proposing that each new emigrant be "matched up" with a citizen to act as their guide.

I can just see that working.................. real well.
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Lance Kennedy » Tue Nov 03, 2015 3:38 am

Actually bobbo, it has already been done. In my country for starters. And it does work. Real well.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby TJrandom » Tue Nov 03, 2015 4:15 am

Lance Kennedy wrote:Actually bobbo, it has already been done. In my country for starters. And it does work. Real well.


Is that essentially a parole officer program? :) Or a community `Welcome wagon` program? Or is there more depth to it?

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Nov 03, 2015 9:28 am

Lance Kennedy wrote:Actually bobbo, it has already been done. In my country for starters. And it does work. Real well.

To be truthful, right after I posted, I felt I was being too negative. I'm sure every country has more than a few people willing to volunteer their time and some amount of other assets to help a stranger...and that is a good thing. But only more than "a few people" compared to the need that is out there. And I did post right after hearing on tv that there was growing protest in Germany over the numbers reported to be taken in. Those good refugees not going to their assigned Countries and going where they prefer. They may be refugees needing help....but they are still people.

As per my other thread: its all about solving for "x". As in most issues, smaller numbers provide a benefit to the whatever the issue is, while "x + y" becomes a negative and even a hazard. Just like milk in my coffee.
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Lance Kennedy » Tue Nov 03, 2015 7:02 pm

TJrandom wrote:
Is that essentially a parole officer program? Or a community `Welcome wagon` program? Or is there more depth to it?


In my country, we did a family sponsor scheme. Each refugee family was paired to a local family, who worked with them to get them settled and happy. In most cases, it worked very well.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Nov 03, 2015 7:41 pm

Lance--you are talking in the Past Tense. The "bulk" of the refugees are yet to come?....and your location says New Zealand. Who did you take in?==Those low islands about to be swamped? Surely not Syrians???

Little more detail? Numbers???

Heck---"anybody" can come stay with me for a week or more. No problem.
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby TJrandom » Tue Nov 03, 2015 7:44 pm

Lance Kennedy wrote:
TJrandom wrote:
Is that essentially a parole officer program? Or a community `Welcome wagon` program? Or is there more depth to it?


In my country, we did a family sponsor scheme. Each refugee family was paired to a local family, who worked with them to get them settled and happy. In most cases, it worked very well.


That sounds like a good program. We don`t accept many (any?) refugees, so I don`t believe there is any such program in place here – even for legal immigrants.

For corporate executive transferees, there are `national club` and company contracted services, but I believe most people just muddle thru their transitions.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Lance Kennedy » Tue Nov 03, 2015 8:42 pm

bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:Lance--you are talking in the Past Tense. The "bulk" of the refugees are yet to come?....and your location says New Zealand. Who did you take in?==Those low islands about to be swamped? Surely not Syrians???

.


As you said, so far small numbers. The refugees have come from a range of countries, including Middle East. I believe we have taken a lot of Iraqis and a lot of Afghanis. Syrians not yet, but we have agreed to take a bunch. I do not think the family sponsor program will be less effective when there are more refugees, but only time will tell.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Nov 03, 2015 8:55 pm

So..............I googled: http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/ ... rotection/

Then for grins, to make a ratio: New Z pop: 4.5 MM to 750 Refugees = .00017%
USA= 320MM at .00017 = 53,000. Thought I heard a few weeks ago we were going to take in 200K and probably more.....on top of our 20 Million Mexicans and South Americans?

Gee......If I were a racist, I would much prefer New Zealands quota system....and oceanic isolation.
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby Lance Kennedy » Tue Nov 03, 2015 9:36 pm

Bobbo

You are correct. That is a ludicrously low number, and I would like to be in a position to influence a change in decision to force and increase. However, the point I made was somewhat different. Simply how well a family sponsorship program works. I am sure that many families would be prepared to assist.

Mind you, I do not think any nation is covering itself with glory over how many refugees it is willing to help. Germany is the best so far, with a statement that it will take 400,000. That sounds a lot, but Germany has a population of 82.5 million. 400,000 is less than 0.5%. In addition, Germany has a falling population, and this influx is less than what is needed to keep the population numbers steady for 12 months. My guess is that Germany could benefit from twice than number each year, just to keep their economy running well.

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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Nov 03, 2015 9:43 pm

Thanks Lance---we (so far) are in total agreement.

Lets test the thin ice: what in the world do the receiving countries "get" out of providing sanctuary especially in NZ case where you didn't practically single handedly cause the situation as we here in the GOUSA did? I accept Germany might if we accept they have a labor shortage and the Ponzi Scheme in favor of Big Business must continue.
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Re: Unconditional Basic Income (UBI)

Postby ElectricMonk » Sun Nov 22, 2015 3:29 pm

@Lance
400,000 is more than 50% of the birth rate in Germany - just the kind of thing that gets nationalist or 'pure race' leaning idiots to go bananas.


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