It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:59 am

Gord wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote::hmm: Has this been mentioned already? Trump shocks GOP by siding with Dems

He knows he'll need the money soon. There's a hurricane headed for Mar-a-Moneypit!

Jim Newell:
The first [possibility] is that [Trump] was confused, and this was the latest expression of how he doesn’t understand Capitol Hill. If that’s the case, he could always change his mind on Twitter within a matter of hours, or just push through it and order his aides to retrofit explanations for how of course he knew what he was doing. The latter process appears to be underway.

The other is that he’s done, or toying with the idea of being done, with congressional Republicans. He has relied on them to push through all of his top priorities, and how’s that worked out for him? At his core, he doesn’t care about what wins he gets, so long as he gets wins. Trump may be recognizing that if you want to get something done on Capitol Hill, your best bet is to bypass Republicans altogether and go straight to Nancy Pelosi.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:39 am

Jeffk 1970 wrote:It just shows what I've said all along, Trump has no loyalty to a party.

Trump ran as an "anti" candidate - and the first phase of that was anti-GOP. What's amazing is the lack of inner resources among Republican leaders in the face of Trumpism. Ever since the Alpha Dog subdued the establishment, they've basically submitted, with Pussygate only the most visible symbol of their submission. Now these craven suck-ups in the leadership are faced with a president who blatantly doesn't give a {!#%@} about them or their party, unless he can use them, and who will zig and zag to suit himself, going so far as to stick thumbs - and even burning hot spearpoints - into their eyes. So much for their party and their strategy.

Even with this so-called deal - Ryan having said only hours earlier of the Democratic proposal “I think that’s a ridiculous idea” and it's “ridiculous and disgraceful” and “unworkable” and “I hope they don’t mean it” - the leadership and many the congressional Republicans surrendered without even putting up a fight (the media are calling Trump's decision a deal, but it really isn't a deal - the Democrats presented their proposal, the Republican theirs, and Trump opted for the Democratic proposal without any concessions or pledges on the Democrats' side):

Kevin Cramer, ND Republican who was not at the meeting, said after appearing with Trump in ND (where Trump virtually endorsed Heitkamp for re-election!), “I will tell you that I gasped when I heard it. When we received that confirmation [of the decision from WH aides], I said, ‘wow.’ I was at a dinner last night where that was not in anybody’s dream. [This] is going to be a tough sell in our conference, there is no question about it.” Cramer hopes leaders eventually can couple speeding cuts into the December package.

As to congressional GOP leaders:
Mitch McConnell: will follow Trump's lead to avoid division at a time like this (!) - “Look, the president can speak for himself, but his feeling was that we needed to come together to not create a picture of divisiveness at a time of genuine national crisis, and that was the rationale”
Chris Collins (early Trump endorser): “obviously” supports Trump's decision, rationalizing that “because of the filibuster, he needed Schumer’s buy-in” - “I would trust that that’s the best deal he could strike”
Barry Loudermilk: the Georgian supports the "deal" with a non-sequitur, “He is a businessman [who] understands you can’t continue to go into debt”
Susan Collins: surprised, such a "deal" "would not have been my first choice"

A number of Republicans simply didn't know what to say, for example, Bruce Westerman: “I don’t know if I’ve given much thought to it”

On the far right - e.g., Amash, Yoho, Brat, Lee, Barton, Republican Study Group - it's a different story - war! Trump's decision is seen as terrible (although Meadows gave Trump some cover, saying if the long game can achieve "conservative wins," he will reconsider his opposition). Movement conservatives - like Jenny Beth Martin of Tea Party Patriots - joined congressional loons in denouncing the "deal" as swampy, same old/same old, etc. A guy named Steve Bannon, according to NY Times reporting, "has spent much of the past two weeks visiting with conservative movement leaders, calling them and hosting them at the Capitol Hill townhouse where he also runs Breitbart. Among them were Ms. Martin, Mr. Brandon, Representative Mark Meadows of the House Freedom Caucus and veterans of past fights between the party’s institutional wing and its restive grass-roots . . ." - many of these sorts want first and foremost to go after Republican congressional leadership.

Paul Ryan has had no comment on Trump's decision. Trump will be having dinner with chew-toy Ryan later this week.

CNN's wild "insider" report on how the debt ceiling meeting at the WH went (Trump even split with Mnuchin! and Ivanka made a cameo!).

Time to update Will Rogers' quip for our GOP friends: "I am not a member of any organized party — I am a Republican." And quote another of Rogers' aphorisms: "Papers say: 'Congress is deadlocked and can't act.' I think that is the greatest blessing that could befall this country."
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:01 am

Jimmy Kimmel on Hillary's new book: “I was just thinking to myself this morning, ‘I would love to relive that magical election of 2016’. It’s like reading a book about why the Titanic sank while you’re sitting at the bottom of the ocean.”
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:11 am

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:Huh?

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_59b02a27e4b0b5e53103120b

Now Trump is siding with Democrats?????


I see a corrupt bargain in the background here. McConnell will offer DACA in exchange for the Wall. What will the Democrats do then?

I can possibly see some concessions on strengthened border security but not on the wall.

Agree. Schumer and Pelosi have not (yet) threatened a shutdown over this, and to their "left" a few congressional Democrats are pressing them to go with only a "clean" DACA bill (one of these, Luis Gutierrez, said “In the beginning it can look awfully lonely” pushing for no compromises).

Even progressive stalwarts Ron Wyden and Sherrod Brown are signaling the exact compromise you predict. Brown:
“We all support border security but we don’t support billions of dollars on one end of Texas building a wall [in exchange for DACA],” Sen. Sherrod Brown (D-OH) told TPM.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:32 am

If the Pukes don't pass some form of DACA===>they are screwed.

If the Puke do build any kind of wall====>they are screwed.

Trying to leverage one to get the other?========what is THAT????????? (.........ok............. bubble think....: another loser)
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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:29 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Even with this so-called deal - Ryan having said only hours earlier of the Democratic proposal “I think that’s a ridiculous idea” and it's “ridiculous and disgraceful” and “unworkable” and “I hope they don’t mean it” - the leadership and many the congressional Republicans surrendered without even putting up a fight (the media are calling Trump's decision a deal, but it really isn't a deal - the Democrats presented their proposal, the Republican theirs, and Trump opted for the Democratic proposal without any concessions or pledges on the Democrats' side)


Well, a so-called deal's a so-called deal, but I don't think Ryan and McConnell are bound by anything that went down at that meeting. If they are, I rejoice. That means they are now officially Trump's marionettes. He'll pull their strings any time he wants to.

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Time to update Will Rogers' quip for our GOP friends: "I am not a member of any organized party — I am a Republican." And quote another of Rogers' aphorisms: "Papers say: 'Congress is deadlocked and can't act.' I think that is the greatest blessing that could befall this country."


Exactly! The rest of the GOP is NOT a Trump marionette. If this shapes up as it appears it will, we may be in for complete paralysis in Washington, and Trump won't be able to deliver anything, for or against the wishes of his base.

(But he WILL be able to look "presidential" as long as FEMA rescue activity goes on, the public being stupid enough to believe that whatever good FEMA does is due to him.)
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:41 am

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Well, a so-called deal's a so-called deal, but I don't think Ryan and McConnell are bound by anything that went down at that meeting. If they are, I rejoice. That means they are now officially Trump's marionettes. He'll pull their strings any time he wants to.

I truly don't think this qualifies as a deal: Trump accepted the Democratic plan in return for nothing (except the Dems voting for their own proposal, I guess!). McConnell and Ryan are not bound, of course; they can do as they wish. McConnell said he'd support Trump's decision. Ryan hasn't said.

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Exactly! The rest of the GOP is NOT a Trump marionette. If this shapes up as it appears it will, we may be in for complete paralysis in Washington, and Trump won't be able to deliver anything, for or against the wishes of his base.

The coalition is fraying. Predicting what happens over the next month is beyond me - except to assume, as we have since January, that tensions, fissures, and realignments will be constant.
Last edited by Statistical Mechanic on Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:41 am

Irma update

And just yesterday, Limbaugh was using the early warnings as a foil to ridicule Al Gore once again and tell people it's all a scam, and all the advance warnings are just promotional gimmicks by large chain stores that he refrained from naming, to sell emergency materials (which of course will just go to waste if the hurricane misses them). He pointed out that Irma is not expected to hit Florida until Sunday.

Oh please tell me he's going to wait until Sunday to buy water or evacuate his mansion in Palm Beach! It's an ill wind that blows nobody good, Irma is wider than Florida and could easily devastate both Limbaugh and Trump in one blow. Evil, nasty person that I am, it is my fondest hope that that happens.

Here's an excerpt, showing how he aims at low-information, reality-denying people who prefer conspiracies to rational explanations:

Rash Limpjaw wrote:Do you realize here in south Florida, from where we are all the way down to Miami, you cannot buy bottled water. This hurricane, if it hits us, is not supposed to hit us until Sunday. It was never going to hit us before Sunday....

The reason that I am leery of forecasts this far out, folks, is because I see how the system works. Now, I don't mean this to be a personal attack on anybody, but the one thing that's undeniable throughout our culture is that everything has been politicized. And in that sense much of our public information system, including from the government, from the Drive-By Media, has been corrupted. It has been corrupted by the individual biases and whatever present bigotry of the people who hold these positions.

You can see it in the way the Deep State deals with Trump. You can see it with the way the intelligence community and the Washington establishment deal with Trump. So in the case of a hurricane, what happens? Well, there are many levels here....

Now, in the official meteorological circles, you have an abundance of people who believe that man-made climate change is real. And they believe that Algore is correct when he has written — and he couldn't be more wrong — that climate change is creating more hurricanes and stronger hurricanes....

So there is a desire to advance this climate change agenda, and hurricanes are one of the fastest and best ways to do it. You can accomplish a lot just by creating fear and panic. You don't need a hurricane to hit anywhere. All you need is to create the fear and panic accompanied by talk that climate change is causing hurricanes to become more frequent and bigger and more dangerous, and you create the panic, and it's mission accomplished, agenda advanced.

There is symbiotic relationship between retailers and local media, and it's related to money. It revolves around money. You have major, major industries and businesses which prosper during times of crisis and panic, such as a hurricane, which could destroy or greatly damage people's homes, and it could interrupt the flow of water and electricity. So what happens?

Well, the TV stations begin reporting this and the panic begins to increase. And then people end up going to various stores to stock up on water and whatever they might need for home repairs and batteries and all this that they're advised to get, and a vicious circle is created. You have these various retail outlets who spend a lot of advertising dollars with the local media.

... I don't want mention brand names because that's not the point. Let's call it Basement Depot. Basement Depot huge, huge business, Basement Depot spends gazillions of dollars every year in local advertising in hurricane forced areas.

Here comes a hurricane, local media goes on the air, "Big hurricane coming, oh, my God! Make sure you got batteries. Make sure you got water. It could be the worst ever. Have you seen the size of this baby? It's already a Cat 5. Oh, my God, oh, my God, it's bigger than the island of Haiti. Oh, my God." People run to the stores, they stock up everything, and they hoard. And they end up with vacant stores, nothing there. And it's a big success. TV stations got eyeballs, the advertising businesses have sold out of business, gotta restock, and the cycle repeats.

This is exactly what's happening. You cannot find a case of bottled water here in Palm Beach. You can't. Miami, probably even worse.
Last edited by Upton_O_Goode on Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:51 am, edited 2 times in total.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:46 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:Well, a so-called deal's a so-called deal, but I don't think Ryan and McConnell are bound by anything that went down at that meeting. If they are, I rejoice. That means they are now officially Trump's marionettes. He'll pull their strings any time he wants to.

It truly don't think this qualifies as a deal: Trump accepted the Democratic plan in return for nothing (except the Dems voting for their own proposal, I guess!). McConnell and Ryan are not bound, of course; they can do as they wish. McConnell said he'd support Trump's decision. Ryan hasn't said.


Yeah, I got that. What I'm wondering is whether it's even less of a so-called deal than appears. Is TRUMP bound by anything he promised Schumer and Pelosi? Would he veto a bill that contains the three-month extension if the Democrats helped to pass it? (Assuming he'd have some plausible excuse that it contained or lacked something else he considered important.) I would like to see him sign off on something that had Democratic support, if only to prove to McConnell that he can't govern with just the Republican Party alone (at least, not until 2019---an ominous thought).
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:53 am

Upton_O_Goode wrote:What I'm wondering is whether it's even less of a so-called deal than appears. Is TRUMP bound by anything he promised Schumer and Pelosi?

No, in fact there's speculation when he figures out he's screwed himself along Ryan/McConnell that he'll decide something else.

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Would he veto a bill that contains the three-month extension if the Democrats helped to pass it?

He certainly can.

Upton_O_Goode wrote: I would like to see him sign off on something that had Democratic support, if only to prove to McConnell that he can't govern with just the Republican Party alone (at least, not until 2019---an ominous thought).

I lean more toward Jeffk's "burn it down" view on this. I'd rather see the Dems fight him hammer and tongs and go with Will Rogers on nothing getting done. If Trump starts "winning" - even with Dem votes - it stabilizes the regime.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Gord » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:12 pm

"Knowledge grows through infinite timelessness" -- the random fictional Deepak Chopra quote site
"You are also taking my words out of context." -- Justin
"Nullius in verba" -- The Royal Society ["take nobody's word for it"]
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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:56 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote: If Trump starts "winning" - even with Dem votes - it stabilizes the regime.

If Trump starts winning WITH Dem votes===>there is no regime.
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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:36 pm

Conservative Caucus (Surprise!!) weighs in AGAINST Trump's agreement with Pelosi and Schumer.

So, they've got three weeks to extend the debt ceiling or risk government default. And they want to delay this process so they can enact what they call "spending reforms," cutting yet more services and aid from the poorest Americans. They say it's urgent to do that. But if it's truly urgent, why would they enable a six-month or eighteen-month extension of the debt, which is what Ryan wants? If the deadline is three months, then urgent action will be required. Isn't that what they say they want?
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:46 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Healthcare "hero" McCain has thrown in with Trump on ACA repeal & replace, supporting Graham/Cassidy, which would dismantle ACA, turn healthcare over to the states, provide federal block-grant funding to the states, scrap most ACA mandates and protections, likely do away with Medicaid expansion, defund Planned Parenthood, and slash federal spending vs the status quo 16% over the next 2 years - and 33% by the mid-'20s.


So Trump will, after all, get a bill that formally destroys Obamacare. Unless one more Republican can be flipped. I hold out hope for that, although I have no candidate in mind. Will McCain be well enough to vote when this comes up? It's a macabre thought, but without his yes vote, there are still only 49 Republicans willing to vote yes, not enough if Menendez is in town and voting with the Democrats, just enough if he isn't. But it's still a risk for McConnell. How long can the Democrats delay this? Apparently, it still can't be filibustered.
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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:38 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Irma update

And just yesterday, Limbaugh was using the early warnings as a foil to ridicule Al Gore once again and tell people it's all a scam, and all the advance warnings are just promotional gimmicks by large chain stores that he refrained from naming, to sell emergency materials (which of course will just go to waste if the hurricane misses them). He pointed out that Irma is not expected to hit Florida until Sunday.

Oh please tell me he's going to wait until Sunday to buy water or evacuate his mansion in Palm Beach! It's an ill wind that blows nobody good, Irma is wider than Florida and could easily devastate both Limbaugh and Trump in one blow. Evil, nasty person that I am, it is my fondest hope that that happens.

Here's an excerpt, showing how he aims at low-information, reality-denying people who prefer conspiracies to rational explanations:

Rash Limpjaw wrote:Do you realize here in south Florida, from where we are all the way down to Miami, you cannot buy bottled water. This hurricane, if it hits us, is not supposed to hit us until Sunday. It was never going to hit us before Sunday....

The reason that I am leery of forecasts this far out, folks, is because I see how the system works. Now, I don't mean this to be a personal attack on anybody, but the one thing that's undeniable throughout our culture is that everything has been politicized. And in that sense much of our public information system, including from the government, from the Drive-By Media, has been corrupted. It has been corrupted by the individual biases and whatever present bigotry of the people who hold these positions.

You can see it in the way the Deep State deals with Trump. You can see it with the way the intelligence community and the Washington establishment deal with Trump. So in the case of a hurricane, what happens? Well, there are many levels here....

Now, in the official meteorological circles, you have an abundance of people who believe that man-made climate change is real. And they believe that Algore is correct when he has written — and he couldn't be more wrong — that climate change is creating more hurricanes and stronger hurricanes....

So there is a desire to advance this climate change agenda, and hurricanes are one of the fastest and best ways to do it. You can accomplish a lot just by creating fear and panic. You don't need a hurricane to hit anywhere. All you need is to create the fear and panic accompanied by talk that climate change is causing hurricanes to become more frequent and bigger and more dangerous, and you create the panic, and it's mission accomplished, agenda advanced.

There is symbiotic relationship between retailers and local media, and it's related to money. It revolves around money. You have major, major industries and businesses which prosper during times of crisis and panic, such as a hurricane, which could destroy or greatly damage people's homes, and it could interrupt the flow of water and electricity. So what happens?

Well, the TV stations begin reporting this and the panic begins to increase. And then people end up going to various stores to stock up on water and whatever they might need for home repairs and batteries and all this that they're advised to get, and a vicious circle is created. You have these various retail outlets who spend a lot of advertising dollars with the local media.

... I don't want mention brand names because that's not the point. Let's call it Basement Depot. Basement Depot huge, huge business, Basement Depot spends gazillions of dollars every year in local advertising in hurricane forced areas.

Here comes a hurricane, local media goes on the air, "Big hurricane coming, oh, my God! Make sure you got batteries. Make sure you got water. It could be the worst ever. Have you seen the size of this baby? It's already a Cat 5. Oh, my God, oh, my God, it's bigger than the island of Haiti. Oh, my God." People run to the stores, they stock up everything, and they hoard. And they end up with vacant stores, nothing there. And it's a big success. TV stations got eyeballs, the advertising businesses have sold out of business, gotta restock, and the cycle repeats.

This is exactly what's happening. You cannot find a case of bottled water here in Palm Beach. You can't. Miami, probably even worse.

I swear Limbaugh sounds like Deng Xiaoping's clique polemicizing against the Gang of 4 in the wake of the Great Tangshan earthquake in '76. I think these clowns have pseudo-Stalinist souls. Breitbart reads like a low-level Maoist weekly rag.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:18 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:I swear Limbaugh sounds like Deng Xiaoping's clique polemicizing against the Gang of 4 in the wake of the Great Tangshan earthquake in '76. I think these clowns have pseudo-Stalinist souls. Breitbart reads like a low-level Maoist weekly rag.


I was thinking in some ways he begins to mimic Trump's own style. He's about 6 years younger than Trump, so perhaps the aphasia is only beginning with him. I find out about him only when one of my neighbors sends me quotations. I listened to him regularly in the 1990s, when he seemed like good comic relief. Then suddenly he wasn't funny any more.

I appreciate your willingness to rake through the muck at Breitbart. That too is something I do only when my neighbor sends me a link to it.
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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:35 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:[ I listened to him regularly in the 1990s, when he seemed like good comic relief. Then suddenly he wasn't funny any more.


I also listened to him in the early 1990's, my roommate in college was a regular. I personally thought Limbaugh was a bag of hot wind but my roommate liked him.

It was funny, the day Bill Clinton was elected I felt like a personal counselor to him. I reassured him that the world would not end and everything would be OK.

Funny how all these years later on November 9th, 2016 I felt like I needed a shrink myself. Along with several stiff drinks and an herbal remedy you cook up in a certain water pipe.....and I haven't done that in 20 years.

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:54 pm

Benadryl, baby, Benadryl.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:55 pm

The day Clinton was elected I basically said to myself, Oh {!#%@}, we're in for it now. My wife got sick of my complaining about the Clintons but she stayed with me :)
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:08 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Healthcare "hero" McCain has thrown in with Trump on ACA repeal & replace, supporting Graham/Cassidy, which would dismantle ACA, turn healthcare over to the states, provide federal block-grant funding to the states, scrap most ACA mandates and protections, likely do away with Medicaid expansion, defund Planned Parenthood, and slash federal spending vs the status quo 16% over the next 2 years - and 33% by the mid-'20s.


So Trump will, after all, get a bill that formally destroys Obamacare. Unless one more Republican can be flipped.

Not sure about that. In fact, it's a big leap: "GOP senator: Bipartisan health care bill coming in 10 days".

My point wasn't to make a prediction but to try putting McCain's "heroism" into proper context.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:12 pm

Trump's debt ceiling bill passed the Senate with 17 "no" votes from Republicans - including Graham, McCain, and Paul. Cruz voted "yes."

Tea Party types are calling for the heads of McConnell and Ryan - because Trump made a "deal" with the Democratic leadership?!?!?
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:18 pm

Interesting review of Clinton's book, from an unnamed former Clinton fundraiser and campaign surrogate: “The best thing she could do is disappear. She’s doing harm to all of us because of her own selfishness. Honestly, I wish she’d just shut the f--- up and go away.”
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:28 pm

Today Trump . . .

. . . tweeted that there will be "No action!" against Dreamers during the 6-month limbo period, sending his message at Pelosi's request

. . . agreed with Schumer to make a joint effort to get Congress to scrap the debt-ceiling process entirely, over Ryan's objections (Ryan today: “I won’t get into a private conversation that we had, but I think there’s a legitimate role for the power of the purse of the Article 1 powers, and that’s something we defend here in Congress.”)
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:39 pm

Something odd with this: Kobach is a columnist for Breitbart?
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:30 am

Seth Myers on the way DJT called his daughter Ivanka to the stage in North Dakota: “Uh, what was that? ‘Bring Your Daughter To Jerk Day?‘ Usually when you hear ‘daddy’ and ‘honey’ that many times you have to clear your browser history.”
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:41 am

One of the 4 pseudo-Dems in the Senate, Joe Mancin, will support linkage of border security funding and restoration of DACA in some form; Mancin supports Trump's DACA termination decision. Mancin didn't mention the {!#%@} Wall but where he's headed seems clear.

This poll and this one suggest that the politically smarter thing for the Dems to do on DACA and the Wall, at least, is the same as the right thing for them to do.

(Tester and Donnelly, two other members of the GOP faction in the Democratic Senate membership, oppose Trump's decision and linkage; Heitkamp, despite palling around with gropers and shitheads, hasn't yet said, although she has made critical comments about ending of DACA.)
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:29 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Trump's debt ceiling bill passed the Senate with 17 "no" votes from Republicans - including Graham, McCain, and Paul. Cruz voted "yes."

Tea Party types are calling for the heads of McConnell and Ryan - because Trump made a "deal" with the Democratic leadership?!?!?


Nice take on this by Doonesbury's "Roland Burton Hedley, Jr."

Roland Hedley wrote:With $150B needed to rebuild Houston, thank God we have Prez comfortable w. assuming massive debt on projects that eventually go underwater.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:32 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Today Trump . . .

. . . tweeted that there will be "No action!" against Dreamers during the 6-month limbo period, sending his message at Pelosi's request


Hmm...I'm quite sure I read in an authoritative source that the White House is sending out memos telling the Dreamers to spend the next six months preparing to move. Then I was surprised to hear Trump reassure them that they would be a very low priority, even when DACA ends. Well, both actions are believable, given this White House.

Trump also promises to revisit this Massive Overreach of Executive Power of Obama's if Congress doesn't act. In other words, he'll do another Massive Overreach of Executive Power, having marched this uphill to the cheers of his base, then marched it (quietly) down again. But it's foolish to predict what Trump will do based on what he says. You might as well try to predict where a fly will alight.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:36 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:One of the 4 pseudo-Dems in the Senate, Joe Mancin, will support linkage of border security funding and restoration of DACA in some form; Mancin supports Trump's DACA termination decision. Mancin didn't mention the {!#%@} Wall but where he's headed seems clear.

This poll and this one suggest that the politically smarter thing for the Dems to do on DACA and the Wall, at least, is the same as the right thing for them to do.

(Tester and Donnelly, two other members of the GOP faction in the Democratic Senate membership, oppose Trump's decision and linkage; Heitkamp, despite palling around with gropers and shitheads, hasn't yet said, although she has made critical comments about ending of DACA.)


This, at least, CAN be filibustered, so we don't need all the Democrats on board, just 41 of them.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:39 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Healthcare "hero" McCain has thrown in with Trump on ACA repeal & replace, supporting Graham/Cassidy, which would dismantle ACA, turn healthcare over to the states, provide federal block-grant funding to the states, scrap most ACA mandates and protections, likely do away with Medicaid expansion, defund Planned Parenthood, and slash federal spending vs the status quo 16% over the next 2 years - and 33% by the mid-'20s.


So Trump will, after all, get a bill that formally destroys Obamacare. Unless one more Republican can be flipped.

Not sure about that. In fact, it's a big leap: "GOP senator: Bipartisan health care bill coming in 10 days".

My point wasn't to make a prediction but to try putting McCain's "heroism" into proper context.



That's a hopeful sign. Maybe even fix some of the problems with the ACA? Of course, such a bill would have to go back to the House. I don't think it would meet the criteria for "reconciliation." My guess is that the Tea Party won't let it pass in the House. At the very least, this puts a tire iron on the railroad tracks in front of the Repeal and Replace Train.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:07 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Today Trump . . .

. . . tweeted that there will be "No action!" against Dreamers during the 6-month limbo period, sending his message at Pelosi's request


Hmm...I'm quite sure I read in an authoritative source that the White House is sending out memos telling the Dreamers to spend the next six months preparing to move.

I think that that notice was what prompted Pelosi's request to Trump. But, for dreamers, how would you know what it all means and how it will end? Pelosi is now saying that Trump told her that he'd sign the DREAM Act if Congress passes it!

Since the Republicans can't pass anything, not even their pet legislation, we will never see Pelosi's word on this tested . . .

Upton_O_Goode wrote:But it's foolish to predict what Trump will do based on what he says. You might as well try to predict where a fly will alight.

This week it is play nice with Dems to shove it to Ryan and McConnell. Fun for a few days, actually. But, you're 100% right, today's behavior is no predictor of tomorrow's.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:13 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:This, at least, CAN be filibustered, so we don't need all the Democrats on board, just 41 of them.

Yup, they hold all the cards, and they can stand a handful of defections. So far, Mancin is all alone on this.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:15 pm

Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:31 pm

Is this the new Party Line from the White House: We can't talk about climate change while hurricanes are striking.

According to Mr. Pruitt that is "insensitive." But tweeting about building a wall along the Texas border while people in Texas are drowning is perfectly OK, apparently.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:10 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:Is this the new Party Line from the White House: We can't talk about climate change while hurricanes are striking.

According to Mr. Pruitt that is "insensitive." But tweeting about building a wall along the Texas border while people in Texas are drowning is perfectly OK, apparently.



I never met Pruitt but my father-in-law knows him. My father-in-law worked for the AG's office in Oklahoma when Pruitt was there. He says that the other employees there thought Pruitt was nuts and were happy to see him go. Pruitt gleefully sued the EPA whenever he got a chance and cost the state millions of dollars, money we could really use right now.

Pruitt happily accepted petroleum industry money during his campaigns for AG, I'm sure that had nothing to do with his stance back then and right now regarding climate change.

:roll:

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:24 pm

Not talking about climate change constitutes criminal negligence directly affecting Floridians. And many others, of course.
Nazism conspired to create a sense of festival time. . . . Tragically for humanity, the party generating it was the type not associated with the coloured costumes of the Brazilian Carnival, but with the brown-shirted thuggery of the NSDAP. The contrast between the dance and the march, between the samba and the strains of the Horst Wessel Lied, points to the gulf separating a life-asserting community from a community which exists only by creating a demonized other. - RG '97

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:18 pm

Current projected path of the hurricane:

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/storm-tracker/

Doesn't look like it will slide back out into the Atlantic but you never know.

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:38 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Not talking about climate change constitutes criminal negligence directly affecting Floridians. And many others, of course.


I notice that Limpjaw has taken off for parts unknown, after telling his listeners not to take the warnings seriously. Probably he was legally required to vacate, but there is something odd about this. Why all the cloak-and-dagger tone to his announcement? Radio personalities often take Friday off, and he regularly did so, as I recall from the 1990s.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:55 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:Current projected path of the hurricane:

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/storm-tracker/

Doesn't look like it will slide back out into the Atlantic but you never know.


Meanwhile, Katia is set to pile more misery on earthquake-devastated Mexico, and Jose may be bringing more trouble to various islands in the Atlantic, although it does appear to be veering off from the US mainland. But, as the map shows, it looks as if Florida gets to do the honors of stopping this juggernaut and passing it on to Georgia and Tennessee as a nasty storm.

I think Limbaugh was doing a gamble. If Irma does veer off, the son of a bitch will never shut up with his I-told-you-so. That's what he was banking on, but he has now flinched. I hope everybody in Florida gets off undamaged (not likely, at this point) EXCEPT him and Trump. I'd like to see the two of them washed out to sea.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller

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Re: It's the Donnydämmerung! (new Trump thread)

Postby Upton_O_Goode » Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:58 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Upton_O_Goode wrote:But it's foolish to predict what Trump will do based on what he says. You might as well try to predict where a fly will alight.

This week it is play nice with Dems to shove it to Ryan and McConnell. Fun for a few days, actually. But, you're 100% right, today's behavior is no predictor of tomorrow's.


I'm rethinking this a bit. If there's a pile of {!#%@} nearby, you CAN predict where a fly will land. That applies to Trump as well.
"A general conversion among the boys was once effected by the late excellent Mr. Fletcher: one poor boy only excepted, who unfortunately resisted the influence of the Holy Spirit, for which he was severely flogged; which did not fail of the desired effect, and impressed proper notions of religion on his mind."

James Lackington, Memoirs of the First Forty-five Years of the Life of James Lackington, the Present Bookseller


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